[Lloyd Gillespie]

Originally Posted by N0B0DY

Lloyd,

They are working on converting more than 5% or so mass to energy, but the equivalency is based on c2. Showing that the fundamental photonic substance is null and void when the gravitational time dilation[IMO, this is fiction.] is not factored in, which in turn is based on massive spacetime objects. No mass equals no gravity equals no phenomenal time dilation for photons. [I would just simply ask you to look at this simple model. Imagine photons, and waves as high speed hydrodynamic ram-jets, critical mass firing into each's successive photon packet and waves, especially when it's the tremendous voltage gamma rays' ram jets___at critical mass firing velocity/speed of C^2. Now picture a mammoth mass of these breeder reacting ram-jets all critical mass exploding in each other's paths, in all directions spheroidally and outwardly, reproducing/propagating themselves___This is the hot scalar wave, and its group velocity multiplications, into extreme true mass values, at the super-sub-quantum___The self-critical mass powered hot wave. Now picture the in-waves, of only thermal motions, slowly compacting and compressing hydrodynamically, all of infinity's FS, or photonic fundamental substance, toward the only possible first singularity center, since it's a set of thermal scalar waves, coming in eternally, from all of infinity___The self-hydrodynamically powered cold wave. I think there's enough real solid mass capability, there, to form a finite universe, because FS absolutely is required to have real mass, even if extremely infinitesimal a measure of___or even truly un-measurable by our present scientific instruments, it's still there, to create the real universe, we all know absolutely exists. It has to be real mass FS, or logic doesn't make sense, then we're all insane. I'll take the sanity of sound logic, thanks. Both cold and hot thermals move the FS, first to the center of infinity, as finiteness evolution, then explode it out, back to the infinite FS, just as any weather system, here on earth or in solar space, moves air/aether within air/aether. I think the FS, is only a borrowed fuel for scalar wave motions, in the finite universe, yet is the entire mechanics of the pre-first star universe. At the same time, it' just one huge thermal mechanical hydrogolic deisel critical mass firing engine, as this is the only propellent I see possible to fit all the needed scientific forces, and actions, of the whole universe. The linguistics, science, math and physics, must be re-done, back into a sensible and possible reality.]

The next question might be, how motionless and massless particles can create massive particles? [As I've described below, there is absolutely no such thing as a motionless and massless particle___This is physics' big myth of uncertainty. The absolute photon, and FS, has and is absolutely required, to have un-measurable mass. No possible instrument can measure a drop of salt water, completely in and within the ocean___The uncertainty principle.]

I think it's already been done through HEP experiments, and it has something to do with a reduction in energy density which is supposed to remain constant. [I know of no possible way for any energy density to remain constant, over universal time/distance___In my universe___Change is all there is.]

Nobody, your question, " The next question might be, how motionless and massless particles can create massive particles?" Somewhere between here and there, one part of physics' texts is dead wrong. Either the photon has energy/mass or it has neither. Physics likes to state they have energy, yet no mass, and as I already stated, this is an impossibility, in leu of the equivalence principle___E=MC^2. So, do you see what I mean. The mass of the photon's energy has been either falsely figured by physics, or the linguistics of the language, when talking about the one absolute fundamental photon/photonic substance/photons is impossible, to make true and rational sense out of. Either, we re-do the physics, to represent photons with real mass, to match their energy, or the whole game of reality does not work, as you have tried to point out, and I have mentioned on many threads, this very FS, math and physics' problem. Even though, at the same time, I have stated that a photon, in the photonic substance, will have no measure, within the substance, and it's always eternally in the FS, so, as I've tried to be clear to you before___It's a true linguistics problem___The real fundamental photon has mass___and it's absolutely un-measurable, as quantum mechanics, has, in its round-about language and gauge theory conglomerations, stated, for years, and by Heisenberg's uncertainty principle___It still holds. We only have sensible logic to figure the FS linguistics problem with, and that requires our adherence to the only law applicable here___Einstein's equivalence principle___E=MC^2, since we absolutely know it functions, as it produced a bomb. It was actually a female, Lisa Mietner, who first split U238, by realizing what had happened in her experiments, when trying to create U239. She used Einstein's E=MC^2 to understand the math mechanics___It measured absolutely accurately, with Einstein's math. So, IMO, the equivalence principle is absolutely correct, and photons are absolutely required to have un-measurable mass, as of our science abilities, to this date. This is where all solid matter reality comes from, and is only produced in solid matter stars, solid matter black-holes, or solid matter star nurseries, between galaxies, in gaseous clouds, and all by the near 0k thermal hydrodynamics of well-known low temperature physics. The only in-waves possible, since they are concave, is from thermal infinity, as all out-waves, being projected through space, are convex, and are absolutely required to be produced by stars, etc., simply because these are the only two possible scientific sources and shapes___Think about it___Only!!! You don't get space-waves from nothing___That's magic___and the universe ain't magic___It's absolutely scientific! You can't get concave in waves from stars, etc., it's Impossible!!! Science better dig out its little toolkit of logic, instead of sitting on it...

As for the debate, I think if Einstein's gravity was put together in a particular fashion so as to not be so conflicting with Newton's, the debate could be resolved.

How would you go about doing it, Lloyd?

Nobody, I don't think there's anything in the real literature of Newton and Einstein, that is in conflict. If you find all of Newton's literature on the subject of mass and gravity, he actually created most of Einstein's ideas for Einstein, and that would make them both stating the 4th dimension is gravity, so there's no debate there. The debate problem arose with quantum mechanics, Planck's e=hf as the smallest possible measurement, the uncertainty principle of Heisenberg, and the big mass agruments over all this. Just as David has stated elsewhere, the entire advance of physics and new theories depends on the clarrification advances in "Mass", alone. This is where the problem is, and I'm afraid, will be for some time, unless some of us can put our thinking caps on and realize both Newton and Einstein are correct as to both mass and gravity, and quantum mechanics is wrong, as to zero mass, or the linguistics of, whatever. The equivalence principle proves the necessity of mass/energy, and photons are admitted to have energy and no mass, yet quantumists, keep coming up with their false zero mass values. Even many classicists falsely interpret Einsteins E=MC^2 wrong, as zero mass, when in reality, he meant no such thing. Einstein and Lorentz realized, early on, that Lorentz's transformation math did not work close to the speed of light, so they never stated anything about zero mass. It's an obvious logical problem Nobody, but as Machiavelli said; "All men have eyes, few have the gift of perception." So, where do you procede, when there seems to be no empirical math possible? All I see is a logical theory___possibility, based on the law of mass/energy equivalence___either it is, or it isn't. It is...!

Yet, thinking about it a bit deeper, there is my model of critical mass entropy, as any mass approaches the speed of light. As I stated, a 10# football nearing the speed of light, is required to give up it's mass, through velocity/mass/entropy, radiating away all its mass, except its photonic and em-wave mass. Of course, all this 10#'s of mass is still present, as radiated energy/mass, just the same as when we explode an atomic bomb___all mass is present and accounted for, as long as we don't use quantum mechanics false zero mass gauge theories, fixed or unfixed, and write it all off, to the uncertainty principle. The 10# football must conform to the entropy laws of physics, just the same as a pot of boiling water, and LaVoissiere proved the first thermodynamic equivalence principle of matter/energy almost two hundred years ago. Nothing dissappears, it's all there, as real mass, no matter what the empirical experiment involved___steel hammers or photons___they're all real FS, and all have real mass, even waves, or they couldn't wave. But, how do you convince a skeptical public, or physics community, that em-waves and photons have real solid mass? All space is real fundamental solid mass, in it's many density states, approaching the infinitesimal mass, of a non-viscous fluidic ground state, but to prove it? Ahhh...quite a feat. Many have tried. Many have failed. Many are again trying to prove it___Will they succeed? We have to, to solve the world's problems, by using such a platform proof, as the power base for other more pressing issues___period, or we perish, as a human race___The radical Mid-Easterners are already threatening damages bigger than Hiroshima. I believe them, so we better start co-operating on the really Big---Idea!

Lloyd