[dleviwing]

iseason;
If 50, 100, 1000, or millions of women decide to give C-section births, do you think over time that one slit will close to favor the man-slit?

Societies should not impose rules where none are needed.

[Mikal]

Hi D...did some research into the increase of c-section births in particular years...was using it in graph form and in comparison to the rise of suicide in the young...there seemed to be a relevant connect almost as if the first perilous journey down the birth canal is somehow the beginning of one's will to live on one hand and the sense of self-preservation on the other...had some interesting discussions with other researchers also wondering why the two graphs when put together seemed to be many young lives with something gone erriely wrong...I still pursue this research but statistical data does not record personal info so must depend on personal revelations of surviving family members...

peace Mikal

[iseason]

Originally Posted by dleviwing

iseason;
If 50, 100, 1000, or millions of women decide to give C-section births, do you think over time that one slit will close to favor the man-slit?

Societies should not impose rules where none are needed.

Hi David,Mikal

The same would apply to broken arms and other injuries if applied to cessarian. No this has more to do with actual function and either awakening a series of events that is currently normal Verses generations not experiencing this.

This also has nothing to do with imposing will or law. Simply, If we don't activate, do we eventually lose the ability to do so . Social aspects are another thread entirely.

I can relate this to short term affects that we do see. The growth of the brain in infants if not stimulated in the first months , loses the ability to catch up. Walking can be set back if not begun correctly. Although these are "real time" cause and effect, What would happen to humanity if we stopped walking? In the short term we would Have a differing wiring system than we have now, but would the long term change our general physiology to suit the new parameter. This is a direct link to what science puts forwards as progress of man . Why not keep regression as a real possibility which is dependant on how we design our future. Because we now have the opportunity do do this much more than we could ever have concieved.

Cheers
Iseason

[Mikal]

Iseason...if we don't activate do we lose the ability to do so??? Well look the ancients and how they refined the instinct to reflect....Jung felt we had that sense but were not using it here...then everybody began to practice meditation which involves refining the sense to reflect...so I don't think we lose it or that it becomes dormant...

Mikal

[austintorn@aol.com]

Guess I'd better use it before I lose it!

[iseason]

Conversly

What if the choice were taken away?

We have seen this done in a social arena. China has gone to one child families. Although this is not a physical change, it will have implications around the world (more so in China) for decades to come. What is happening now that a great percentage of Chinese adults reaching sexual maturity are male?
The one child family was supposed to reduce China's population, but will it change it socially forever?.

Suppose the reasons for institutional births was compelling enough (and we had the technology) to ensure that no birth defects , disease,weakness and abnormal behaviour traits . Isn't evolution about ensuring your genetic blueprint becomes superior over your competitors? I am not at all convinced that we have put up enough counter arguements in the lead up to our current usage of science to move it any further forwards. Not on the basis of morality, because this has been ignored and overiden all the way here, but on regression of species basis.

That is why I am not using a morality based arguement and why I am not interested in finding new ones. IVF and our right to breed are not controlled by those who's future will be affected, The background research shows that even before we are aware, the technology exists. What if the technology exists already (and it does in the form of birth control) to prevent natural births occurring? Then we don't have a choice as to whether they occur . but again, not morality, where does the human race go from there.

Mikal. You said you followed how suicides and IVF followed each other. You should also include single parent families, single sibling families, multi-sire families and the effect on the life before the suicide. Because all of this came along side each other.

Cheers
Iseason

[Mikal]

Iseason.... I examined the rise in c-section simultaneous with the rise in suicides...In this study I took one young suicide and included life history from birth, family, the one sibling family and the existing stages of growth and cycle of life passages which was minimal due to a short life. I assure you nothing was left out which could have been included. I also found it quite intriguing that the only country which did not normalize c-sections as a means of birth did not have young suicides to report. Also followed the work and study of Dr. Thomas Verny who studied birth passages.


Mikal