[RascalPuff]

Originally Posted by Profpat Dear RP and Michael; I'm back from Chicago with some fresh thoughts about parallel universes. I read a most informative article on PARALLEL UNIVERSES by Max Tegmark on the internet. He classified the theories by 4 levels. Level 1 is the one I am talking about. Everything is the same except I would be left handed rather then right. When I get up my parallel Pat would get up . When I die he dies. It is also very, very, very far away. He also discussed ones sharing our space and universes of all possibilities happening. Levels 2 through 4 theories. He stated that its physically possibe to have parallel universe(s) and the main arguement against it is Occams Razor. If you don't need it why have it, and even if you did have one you can't observe it. Well I think we might need at least One Parallel Universe to resolve the asymmetricl view of the Big Bang. With a parallel universe we would restore symmetry at creation. And with symmetry restored RP I think your 2 universes intermeshed at the edges ( if the universe has an edge ) internally turning. one with a left spin and other with a right spin, revolving around each other could indeed make a lot of sense. And its eerie that the yin/yang symbol ( The Diagram of the Supreme Ultimate ) symbolizing that same image. I guess to make that image perfect I would think ours would be the dark universe and the other principally luminated, since we have mostly dark matter and dark energy. I know you don't like the idea of dark stuff RP, but it would match the symbol. And following Occams Razor I think we only need 2 universes. Just some recent thoughts. Best. Pat

__________________________________

Dear Prof:

(quote)
Well I think we might need at least One Parallel Universe to resolve the asymmetricl view of the Big Bang. With a parallel universe we would restore symmetry at creation.
__________________

Generally going along with you on this Level One reasoning, Prof.
(Although Truly Yours is a Steady State advocate, we don't require a big bang to qualify the - balanced symmetry - issue at hand.)
___________________


(quote)
And with symmetry restored RP I think your 2 universes intermeshed at the edges ( if the universe has an edge ) internally turning. one with a left spin and other with a right spin, revolving around each other could indeed make a lot of sense.
______________________

The restoration of symmetry - in consideration of a parallel (matching, mirror image) universe - may inevitably include *bilateral symmetry (I think *that is what you may intend, Prof?), as it occurs so prolifically in Nature.

The bodies of practically all living things - flora & fauna - are bilaterally (and often multi) symmetrical. The old adage of two hands clapping incorporates the entire concept of bilateral symmetry - with the two mirror image hands coming together in harmonious opposition. Juxtaposed mirror image arms, legs, *cerebral hemispheres (*Mustn't forget Michael's justified obsession with consciousness), paws and claws and innumerably paired off doo dahs.

Then we mustn't forget the Biblical counterpart for The binary Dating Game on Noah's ark.

Ensembles of bilaterally symmetrical multi-moment systems spinning bumper to bumper and side by side - reading and reflecting each other five by five - on a heirarchy of large and small rotisseries.

With visions of the curvature of 4-D spacetime from books being read in and out of the aethereal godhead..

With Occams's razor bisecting all the apples falling to land nearest their upper and lower brachiated source.

Your thoughts are a lot to think about, Prof.
Surely there's more of your inspiration where that came from.

Thanks for the URL.

Best regards,
-RP

P.S. Incidentally, mine is not so much a disagreement with 'dark energy' as it is a long time concept of 'functional space' (re: Ernst Mach), which the term 'dark enenrgy' has mysteriously replaced (as though it's something previously unconsidered - sorta like black holes, relatively new <rave> term, paralleling my 47 year old concept of a contracting 4-D space-time continuum).

Please continue your scintillating quest, Prof.
We need all the inspiration you can garner?

[RascalPuff]

Originally Posted by Profpat Dear RP and Michael; I'm back from Chicago with some fresh thoughts about parallel universes. I read a most informative article on PARALLEL UNIVERSES by Max Tegmark on the internet. He classified the theories by 4 levels. Level 1 is the one I am talking about. Everything is the same except I would be left handed rather then right. When I get up my parallel Pat would get up . When I die he dies. It is also very, very, very far away. He also discussed ones sharing our space and universes of all possibilities happening. Levels 2 through 4 theories. He stated that its physically possibe to have parallel universe(s) and the main arguement against it is Occams Razor. If you don't need it why have it, and even if you did have one you can't observe it. Well I think we might need at least One Parallel Universe to resolve the asymmetricl view of the Big Bang. With a parallel universe we would restore symmetry at creation. And with symmetry restored RP I think your 2 universes intermeshed at the edges ( if the universe has an edge ) internally turning. one with a left spin and other with a right spin, revolving around each other could indeed make a lot of sense. And its eerie that the yin/yang symbol ( The Diagram of the Supreme Ultimate ) symbolizing that same image. I guess to make that image perfect I would think ours would be the dark universe and the other principally luminated, since we have mostly dark matter and dark energy. I know you don't like the idea of dark stuff RP, but it would match the symbol. And following Occams Razor I think we only need 2 universes. Just some recent thoughts. Best. Pat

__________________________________

Dear Prof:

(quote)
Well I think we might need at least One Parallel Universe to resolve the asymmetricl view of the Big Bang. With a parallel universe we would restore symmetry at creation.
__________________

Generally going along with you on this Level One reasoning, Prof.
(Although Truly Yours is a Steady State advocate, we don't require a big bang to qualify the - balanced symmetry - issue at hand.)
___________________


(quote)
And with symmetry restored RP I think your 2 universes intermeshed at the edges ( if the universe has an edge ) internally turning. one with a left spin and other with a right spin, revolving around each other could indeed make a lot of sense.
______________________

The restoration of symmetry - in consideration of a parallel (matching, mirror image) universe - may inevitably include *bilateral symmetry (I think *that is what you may intend, Prof?), as it occurs so prolifically in Nature.

The bodies of practically all living things - flora & fauna - are bilaterally (and often multi) symmetrical. The old adage of two hands clapping incorporates the entire concept of bilateral symmetry - with the two mirror image hands coming together in harmonious opposition. Juxtaposed mirror image arms, legs, *cerebral hemispheres (*Mustn't forget Michael's justified obsession with consciousness), paws and claws and innumerably paired off doo dahs.

Then we mustn't forget the Biblical counterpart for The binary Dating Game on Noah's ark.

Ensembles of bilaterally symmetrical multi-moment systems spinning bumper to bumper and side by side - reading and reflecting each other five by five - on a heirarchy of large and small rotisseries.

With visions of the curvature of 4-D spacetime from books being read in and out of the aethereal godhead..

With Occams's razor bisecting all the apples falling to land nearest their upper and lower brachiated source.

Your thoughts are a lot to think about, Prof.
Surely there's more of your inspiration where that came from.

Thanks for the URL. http://www.hep.upenn.edu/~max/multiverse.pdf
Which reminds me to post mine again, since the last time it was mistaken, the correct URL to my site is http://forums.delphiforums.com/EinsteinGroupie (please share your popcorn).

Best regards,
-RP

P.S. Incidentally, mine is not so much a disagreement with 'dark energy' as it is a long time concept of 'functional space' (re: Ernst Mach), which the term 'dark enenrgy' has mysteriously replaced (as though it's something previously unconsidered - sorta like black holes, relatively new <rave> term, paralleling my 47 year old concept of a contracting 4-D space-time continuum).

Please continue your scintillating quest, Prof.
We need all the inspiration you can garner?

[Profpat]

Thank you for those kind words RP.

Actually on this thread you have been my inspiration, from spinning coins to the 3 body problem to researching parallel universes to now researching symmetry.

My quick wikipedia research yielded such treasures as Mathematical symmetry, Directional symmetry, Rotational symmetry, and a whole lot more. I have my reading assignment this weekend.

Yes I envision bilateral ( left /right ) symmetry in our parallel universes. Even in movement they maintain that symmetry. The same would be true for my Venn diagram proton model.

By the way, though you like the steady state model, there could still be a parallel universe, as you mentioned it wouldn't be necessary to explain the asymmetrical problem now facing the big bang theory, but it still might be there. ( Yes/No )?

And thank you I'm staying in that level 1 model of parallel universes.

Now here is a thought; could our parallel universes be as flat and 2 dimensional as the yin/yang symbol?
I know that symbol could be expressed 3 dimensionally but rarely is.

Well I have to do some reading ( your site for sure ) and thinking.

Again thank you.

Pat

[mkirkpatrick]

I think the most obvious parallel universe must be the one that inpinges
on us all the time,that of the astral/etheric universe,which is parallel to
ours,and slightly out of phase with it,although they do overlap at times,
I have witnessed this many times myself when sitting in a circle/seance,
one can often see a blue mist billowing and rolling along the floor,much like
cold air from a freezer when the door is opened,rolls out and drops to the floor,a dimensional doorway opens and allows energy to flow between the two.



regards michael.

[Profpat]

Michael you may be right.

I know the time I tranced myself I wasn't in this universe anymore. Just an Awareness of I AM (not Pat ) and darkness and light, and the complete Awareness that all is illusion. When I began losing the Awareness is when I came back to this plane. That experience was so real to me that I still believe that all is illusion. But since its persistent, lets talk about your universe.

I don't think its going to resolve the problem of our asymmetrical universe. If your universe was composed of antiparticles then every time that door way was open BANG. Since that didn't happen I assume it wasn't antiparticles.

Might your universe be a time tunnel? A little out of sync? Then again according to the article there could be all types of parallel universes.

My most recent research ( thanks to RP ) had me looking up C.P.T. Symmetry ( Charge Parity and Time).

To quote from wikipedia "The implication of CPT symmetry is that a mirror-image of our universe -
with all objects having momenta and position reflected by an imaginary plane ( corresponding to a parity inversion), with all matter replaced by antimatter ( corresponding to a charge inversion ), and reversed in time- would evolve exactly like our universe."(reversed in time going counter clockwise )

That would be the Yin/Yang universe that I envisioned. With that our asymmetrical problem would be solved and the total baryonic would be 0.( B=0 ).

Being an accountant I have problems when things seem out of balance or you can't account for a million or billion universes. They just disappear I guess in the big bang process, unless you have the creation of two universes being created side by side simultaneously. ( or steady state )

Well I am still thinking. I will return.( God willing)

Best to all,

Pat

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by Profpat Michael you may be right. I know the time I tranced myself I wasn't in this universe anymore. Just an Awareness of I AM (not Pat ) and darkness and light, and the complete Awareness that all is illusion. When I began losing the Awareness is when I came back to this plane. That experience was so real to me that I still believe that all is illusion. But since its persistent, lets talk about your universe. I don't think its going to resolve the problem of our asymmetrical universe. If your universe was composed of antiparticles then every time that door way was open BANG. Since that didn't happen I assume it wasn't antiparticles. Might your universe be a time tunnel? A little out of sync? Then again according to the article there could be all types of parallel universes. My most recent research ( thanks to RP ) had me looking up C.P.T. Symmetry ( Charge Parity and Time). To quote from wikipedia "The implication of CPT symmetry is that a mirror-image of our universe - with all objects having momenta and position reflected by an imaginary plane ( corresponding to a parity inversion), with all matter replaced by antimatter ( corresponding to a charge inversion ), and reversed in time- would evolve exactly like our universe."(reversed in time going counter clockwise ) That would be the Yin/Yang universe that I envisioned. With that our asymmetrical problem would be solved and the total baryonic would be 0.( B=0 ). Being an accountant I have problems when things seem out of balance or you can't account for a million or billion universes. They just disappear I guess in the big bang process, unless you have the creation of two universes being created side by side simultaneously. ( or steady state ) Well I am still thinking. I will return.( God willing) Best to all, Pat

Most grateful for your reply Pat,I identify with your experience,and with your
thoughts of Ying and Yang,I suppose being an accountant you do not want too many loose ends,everything needs to tie up and balance.

warm regards michael.

[Profpat]

Michael;

When you tranced yourself and had the OBE, did you go further then I did. Did you lose you self awareness, and if so was there any additional enlightment?

The point where I stopped was the realization that all is illusion but when I started to lose self awareness is when I got scared and quickly came back to my body.

I know this is somewhat off the topic but if you have anything additional to share about your experience, I for one would love to hear it.

If you prefer (for privacy reasons) you can do it by PM. Or if you care not to divulge thats OK too.

Thanks for everything,

Pat

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by Profpat Michael; When you tranced yourself and had the OBE, did you go further then I did. Did you lose you self awareness, and if so was there any additional enlightment? The point where I stopped was the realization that all is illusion but when I started to lose self awareness is when I got scared and quickly came back to my body. I know this is somewhat off the topic but if you have anything additional to share about your experience, I for one would love to hear it. If you prefer (for privacy reasons) you can do it by PM. Or if you care not to divulge thats OK too. Thanks for everything, Pat

Will contact you via a PM Pat,best of all to you.

regards michael.

[Profpat]

Thank You Michael

[austintorn@aol.com]

(switched the arrow)