Knowledge vs. Religion

[jag]

Knowledge comes from our experience.

We should make sure that our science doesn't overreach because of our desire to take a gaint step forward in our understanding of something. We'll get there.

Knowledge deals with facts.

Knowledge originates in science.

I think the physics community has crossed the boundary between science and religion with the concept of the BIG BANG. I, for one, don't believe it.

The LHC experiment is based on the theory of the existance of a "GOD PARTICLE", and we think this particle is what makes something out of nothing. ___I'm all about understanding this process but___ Since we think that this process of going from nothing to something must have happened in the fraction of a second after this "BIG BANG" this "PHANTOM PARTICLE" can be found under those conditions.

The essence of our knowledge is being stretched to support this BIG BANG theory. If we missunderstand and misuse the essence of our knowledge we might go off the path tomporarily. No big deal if we learn from it and see more clearly what the nature of knowledge truly is.

"I don't know but I believe"

jag

[austintorn@aol.com]

The 'God' particle is misnamed; it is only the particle that would give mass, just as important or as unimportant as one for force or energy or whatever.

No one really knows if there was a Big Bang, many scientists even saying so.

No one who states a position about the origin of the universe, much less a finely detailed book about it, really knows anything but zilch; thus, their beliefs are arbitrary, as we see all around the world. The trouble is that then they fight about it. Such infectious ideas based on nothing but inventive imagination are ever dangerous to all. Don't catch the fever from the virus; it could be deadly.

My maker-upper of the day is that all is a dream.

[jag]

Austin

If we don't continue to reach for new understanding then all of the knowledge we thought we had is just a dream and the illusion of life is nothing more than a fantasy in the mind of God. A dream within a dream.
The only question is, how hard should we push the envelope?

"The sleeper must awaken"

jag

[austintorn@aol.com]

Hi jag,

I was just copying an origin of the universe answer from somewhere else, as I put out a different one every day or so. Everybody eventually gets a chance to say that that one [today] is a SURE THING and all the other ones were WRONG. In that way, we see that all these SURE THINGS are made up.

Scientists always push the envelope, for they have inquiring minds; The SURE THINGers work is complete and done; no need to push the envelope, plus it is invisible anyway, so, that mind becomes limited; it even stops and thinks no deeper when a magical answer is said.

[jag]

Hi Austin,

I'm with you on the "SURE THINGers" and their attempts to kill klowledge. It's the old, "don't confuse me with the facts. My mind is made up."

It's all happening without beginning and without end. (tongue in cheek)
"Here I am stuck in the middle with you" Bob D.

jag

[jag]

Hi jag,

I was just copying an origin of the universe answer from somewhere else, as I put out a different one every day or so. Everybody eventually gets a chance to say that that one [today] is a SURE THING and all the other ones were WRONG. In that way, we see that all these SURE THINGS are made up.
.

Hi austin,

Knowledge is bringing us closer to a connection with God, the ultimate sure thing

Knowledge is religion without dogma.

jag

[austintorn@aol.com]

THE NATURAL HAPPENING

Why these little subatomic things, ask the wise,
In such amounts and of their special size?
Well, I agree that this shows they had to be made
As we see is from the causeless quantum’s shade;

It’s been shown by Aspect there’s nothing hidden
Underneath this necessarily indefinite disorder
Whence random particles become, unbidden,
For causes beneath causes would have no border.

So, from this causeless bottom where bucks stop,
Hails the ultimate freedom to live and be a lot.
This scheme, undone, hints that the Ultimate Yore
If it could ever be, would need cause all the more.

Yet, at this very point, which is not an answer,
But a call to think no more and surrender,
Religion introduces Complexity Infinite
For the downwardly simpler bottom unit.

So, there’s no answer given, but only
A larger mystery of the One and Only
That is an infinitely larger question there,
Rendering the entire ‘answer’ beyond repair.

While both science and religion claim the causeless,
They are as opposite as could be, none the less,
For one finds no specifics there, none at all,
While the other imagines a Perfect Ordered All.

If all the above opposed were not bad enough,
There is entirely insufficient evidence for God;
Zero, in fact, in the face of the opposite there,
For One who is supposed to be everywhere.

Beyond that of even the absence of evidence
For the interceding Ruler, the obvious nonpresence,
Which leads to the sure evidence of absence,
Is: that a first cause can have no reason to it.

Plus, that we observe the random emanations.

Humanists [non theists] push science forward
God naturally flunking out, with no pushes backward,
While creationists, with nothing to push forward,
Ever attempt to push science backward.

This, then, is the end of faith’s season,
Being the celebration of logical reason.

[jag]

Our minds are orbiting our heart,
waiting....watching for a piece of truth to appear.
Light ignored is darkness.

Our heart of truth sees all...knows our need.

Would that our minds could know our heart.
The truth or heart, wants to be known.
Oneness is heart.

"The universal father is not invisible because he is hiding himself away from the lowly creatures of materalistic handicaps and limited spiritual endowments. The situation rather is: "you cannot see my face, for no mortal man can see me and live." No material man could behold the spirit of God and preserve his mortal existence. The glory and the spiritual brilliance of the devine personality presence is impossible to approach by the lower groups of spirit beings or by any order of material personalities...The spiritual luminosity of the father's personal presence is a light which no mortal man can approach; Which no material creature has seen or can see. But it is not necessary to see God with the eyes of the flesh in order to discern him by the faith-vision of the spiritualized mind."

"Better that science be devoted to the
destruction of superstition rather than attempting
the overthrow of religious faith....human belief
in spiritual realities and divine values."

You should have heard what I saw
instead of me singing it to you.
I don't think I sing so good

jag