[Drifter]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com I've been receiving the 'Journal of Consciousness Studies' for about ten years now, and Mikal is correct that there is no workable answer yet, just many theories, of which Bentov's is one. No one has even come close to solving Chalmer's well posed 'hard problem'. Consciousness could merely be the brain's perception of itself or much more. No one knows yet. It would then be a mistake, then, to assume any one theory and let it rule your life. Bentov left us prematurely over 25 years ago, but there is still no proof yet of his theory that we are thought receivers. As for his holographic theory, my first post on ToeQuest proposed that the 3rd dimension could be a projection; however, this would mean that all is still real in 2-D and that it would represent nature's efficient workings, nothing more. http://www.toequest.com/forum/the-hi...verything.html Even though some of what I propose in my first post may even sound great (maybe to Drifter), I can't accept it myself or live by it for it is just a theory based on not very much. One has to be careful not to let assumptions turn into rules to live by. Many human mammals guess at things and then claim a proof of a truth.

As long as man can wonder at the marvels of this world...he will always find something to challenge. Rest in Peace A.
ps Thanks for you suggestion/post, much ado here with moving (only one nobody here)I will have to catch up again later.

There's really nobody to know, you know, all our intelligence comes from outside sources really. We merely "receive" through our illuminecent/illuminating capacity, call them reflections/illusions or "reality" it really makes no difference...When the candle goes out, then we'll all be Gnostics. Nothing arbitrary or ambiguous about that. puff, the last feeble sound we hear in this realm, when nobody finaly goes home and the incessant one finally subsides leaving us in blissful sleep and everlasting peace. amen

[Drifter]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com I've been receiving the 'Journal of Consciousness Studies' for about ten years now, and Mikal is correct that there is no workable answer yet, just many theories, of which Bentov's is one. No one has even come close to solving Chalmer's well posed 'hard problem'. Consciousness could merely be the brain's perception of itself or much more. No one knows yet. It would then be a mistake, then, to assume any one theory and let it rule your life. Bentov left us prematurely over 25 years ago, but there is still no proof yet of his theory that we are thought receivers. As for his holographic theory, my first post on ToeQuest proposed that the 3rd dimension could be a projection; however, this would mean that all is still real in 2-D and that it would represent nature's efficient workings, nothing more. http://www.toequest.com/forum/the-hi...verything.html Even though some of what I propose in my first post may even sound great (maybe to Drifter), I can't accept it myself or live by it for it is just a theory based on not very much. One has to be careful not to let assumptions turn into rules to live by. Many human mammals guess at things and then claim a proof of a truth.

As long as man can wonder at the marvels of this world...he will always find something to challenge. Rest in Peace A.
ps Thanks for you suggestion/post, much ado here with moving (only one nobody here)I will have to catch up again later.

There's really nobody to know, you know, all our intelligence comes from outside sources really. We merely "receive" through our illuminecent/illuminating capacity, call them reflections/illusions or "reality" it really makes no difference...When the candle goes out, then we'll all be Gnostics. Nothing arbitrary or ambiguous about that. puff, the last feeble sound we hear in this realm, when nobody finaly goes home and the incessant one subsides...finally leaving us in our blissful sleep and everlasting peace. amen = (so be it)

[Mikal]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com I've been receiving the 'Journal of Consciousness Studies' for about ten years now, and Mikal is correct that there is no workable answer yet, just many theories, of which Bentov's is one. No one has even come close to solving Chalmer's well posed 'hard problem'. Consciousness could merely be the brain's perception of itself or much more. No one knows yet. It would then be a mistake, then, to assume any one theory and let it rule your life. Bentov left us prematurely over 25 years ago, but there is still no proof yet of his theory that we are thought receivers. As for his holographic theory, my first post on ToeQuest proposed that the 3rd dimension could be a projection; however, this would mean that all is still real in 2-D and that it would represent nature's efficient workings, nothing more. http://www.toequest.com/forum/the-hi...verything.html Even though some of what I propose in my first post may even sound great (maybe to Drifter), I can't accept it myself or live by it for it is just a theory based on not very much. One has to be careful not to let assumptions turn into rules to live by. Many human mammals guess at things and then claim a proof of a truth.

Austie...I guess I should have discussed with you my present study into Chalmers...was not aware that you were familiar with Chalmers' presentation of "hard problems" with theories of consciousness formed almost into rigid, fixed dogmas.

His presentational work is exceptionally profound in argument and also the expansion and clarity of his arguments. Its fascinating how he puts forward the idea that the understanding of consciousness can be broken down into psychological and phenomenal environments, especially the phenomenal which of course as he describes would be the feelings and sensations we experience as being conscious or actually feeling ourselves living in our lives. Chalmers clearly reveals the complexities we face in attempting to fix a theory of Consciousness and aids us in moving away from setting anything in stone....


Mikal

[Drifter]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com I've been receiving the 'Journal of Consciousness Studies' for about ten years now, and Mikal is correct that there is no workable answer yet, just many theories, of which Bentov's is one. No one has even come close to solving Chalmer's well posed 'hard problem'. Consciousness could merely be the brain's perception of itself or much more. No one knows yet. It would then be a mistake, then, to assume any one theory and let it rule your life. Bentov left us prematurely over 25 years ago, but there is still no proof yet of his theory that we are thought receivers. As for his holographic theory, my first post on ToeQuest proposed that the 3rd dimension could be a projection; however, this would mean that all is still real in 2-D and that it would represent nature's efficient workings, nothing more. http://www.toequest.com/forum/the-hi...verything.html Even though some of what I propose in my first post may even sound great (maybe to Drifter), I can't accept it myself or live by it for it is just a theory based on not very much. One has to be careful not to let assumptions turn into rules to live by. Many human mammals guess at things and then claim a proof of a truth.

I will try to come back to this unless my computer gives uo "The Ghost". It's Smokin!?...Toast Anyone?... Coffee and Crumpets???

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=s42mrd...eature=related

[Drifter]

O God! Refresh and gladden my spirit. Purify my heart. Illumine my powers. I lay all my affairs in Thy hand. Thou art my Guide and my Refuge. I will no longer be sorrowful and grieved; I will be a happy and joyful being. O God! I will no longer be full of anxiety, nor will I let trouble harass me. I will not dwell on the unpleasant things of life.

O God! Thou art more friend to me than I am to myself. I dedicate myself to Thee, O Lord.

- 'Abdu'l-Bahá

(Compilations, Baha'i Prayers, p. 150)

[austintorn@aol.com]

Drift, who is this Lord God Guy who gets your e-mails and sends you outside help?

[Drifter]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com Drift, who is this Lord God Guy who gets your e-mails and sends you outside help?

The Greeks called it their genius, which came into being at consception, 'we' know it as the god of our own understanding or our true Higher Consciousness, Lord God His Self imho. "My Father and and I are One...He is greater than I." It is so simple, and sweet, but it does take effort until the epiphany/miracle/awakening by Grace happens, to reprogram 20, 30, 40, 50 years of Impostor Ignorance aka culture and conditioning. both social and religious.

May you find Him now...

namaste` to your Spirit
D.

[austintorn@aol.com]

What Consciousness imposed this arena enabling Impostor Ignorance upon us? Was that a Goof?

Also, thanks for the clarification that the Bahai Lord God matches your own description and not the biblical type that you don't believe in. I didn't know much about Bahai.

[Drifter]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com What Consciousness imposed this arena enabling Impostor Ignorance upon us? Was that a Goof? Also, thanks for the clarification that the Bahai Lord God matches your own description and not the biblical type that you don't believe in. I didn't know much about Bahai.

'self' ( ego) consciousness... promulgated by the 'puppetere's' of ignorance of many aforementioned links...whom do not want an awakened society...THey would then be exposed and vulnerable...look for 'castles' and who lives in then or operates them.
That doesnn;t mean to say temples though many would be included in such a shadow society.

The closest you can get to any god is to know your own Higher Self. It is a Conscious Entity an He/She/It/That Is Which Is Within, drop all illusion for a given time and allow the miracle of awakening/gnosis to happen to 'you'...it is really that easy, and that difficult.

Namaste`to the Spirit, your Higher Consciousness, within 'you'. Tat Tvam Asi. Thou Art That. We all are The All as That, that is creation. Unity, Wholesomeness and Oneness, That's what we are in our true essence. We give it up to the impostor. Itr doesn't have or need be. It is the tyrant within us which at times can drive 'us' to do somewhat unspeakable things, without question.
Remmember the puppy-toss video? By an otherwise 'hero'? What will he tell his children and his grand-children when they see him 'in action'?

Namaste`
D.

[austintorn@aol.com]

What kind of Originator would put a tyrant in us? It seems like a devilish thing. Or was it necessary to evolution and still has some uses?