[Benedict Broere]

I wonder, when Nietzsche ascertained Gods demise, was he than lacking activity in his 'God-part'?

I think, at least my first impression is, this God-part-theory is lacking looking at human history. There's a story to tell about the evolution from animism until modern naturalism and panentheism.

To me religion had always very much to do with story-telling and meaning-searching. Within our practical daily life we were always concerned with the meaning of thing's: the meaning of a bow and arrow, the meaning of a good boat, the meaning of improving agriculture, the meaning of good clothing, etcetera. We are meaning-searching organisms. And if we weren't we probably won't be here as a species, or we would be just a kind of monkeys, dwelling in a small niche of nature. So religion may be a kind of spin-of. Once we widend our view on things and asked: what is the meaning of all this? And than we started filling in, telling stories, with what we knew at a certain fase of cultural developement. And being already rather creative, in inventing architecture and culture in general, we started to think something creative might be behind everything - we understand what we are and already know, isn't it?

Still, it is remarkable non-religious worldviews came up, at least with some thinkers in ancient Greece, Roman culture, India and China, and really became a general phenomenon in the Modern Time. Where Nietzsche comes in.

Still nonreligious worldview is statisticly in the modern world a minor phenomenon. With next to it parts that are agnostic, or believing in 'something', or a deminishing part of churchgoing believers - at least in Europe, NortWest-Europe.

This God-part, it looks as if it also has to do with sex, orgasms, and peaks in houseparties, bungyjumping, longrunning, etcetera.

Next step is a pill which gives you instant mystical experience. Big business! Competition for LSD, crack and what have you. But all products the real mystic would despise of.

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by Benedict Broere I wonder, when Nietzsche ascertained Gods demise, was he than lacking activity in his 'God-part'? I think, at least my first impression is, this God-part-theory is lacking looking at human history. There's a story to tell about the evolution from animism until modern naturalism and panentheism. To me religion had always very much to do with story-telling and meaning-searching. Within our practical daily life we were always concerned with the meaning of thing's: the meaning of a bow and arrow, the meaning of a good boat, the meaning of improving agriculture, the meaning of good clothing, etcetera. We are meaning-searching organisms. And if we weren't we probably won't be here as a species, or we would be just a kind of monkeys, dwelling in a small niche of nature. So religion may be a kind of spin-of. Once we widend our view on things and asked: what is the meaning of all this? And than we started filling in, telling stories, with what we knew at a certain fase of cultural developement. And being already rather creative, in inventing architecture and culture in general, we started to think something creative might be behind everything - we understand what we are and already know, isn't it? Still, it is remarkable non-religious worldviews came up, at least with some thinkers in ancient Greece, Roman culture, India and China, and really became a general phenomenon in the Modern Time. Where Nietzsche comes in. Still nonreligious worldview is statisticly in the modern world a minor phenomenon. With next to it parts that are agnostic, or believing in 'something', or a deminishing part of churchgoing believers - at least in Europe, NortWest-Europe. This God-part, it looks as if it also has to do with sex, orgasms, and peaks in houseparties, bungyjumping, longrunning, etcetera. Next step is a pill which gives you instant mystical experience. Big business! Competition for LSD, crack and what have you. But all products the real mystic would despise of.

You could be right there Benedict,maybe there is a lab-somwhere researching that very thing!!!

kind regards michael.

[HappytheStripper]

By Steven Swinford
Times Online

The scientist who led the team that cracked the human genome is to publish a book explaining why he now believes in the existence of God and is convinced that miracles are real.
Francis Collins, the director of the US National Human Genome Research Institute, claims there is a rational basis for a creator and that scientific discoveries bring man “closer to God”.
His book, The Language of God, to be published in September, will reopen the age-old debate about the relationship between science and faith. “One of the great tragedies of our time is this impression that has been created that science and religion have to be at war,” said Collins, 56.
“I don’t see that as necessary at all and I think it is deeply disappointing that the shrill voices that occupy the extremes of this spectrum have dominated the stage for the past 20 years.”
For Collins, unravelling the human genome did not create a conflict in his mind. Instead, it allowed him to “glimpse at the workings of God”.
“When you make a breakthrough it is a moment of scientific exhilaration because you have been on this search and seem to have found it,” he said. “But it is also a moment where I at least feel closeness to the creator in the sense of having now perceived something that no human knew before but God knew all along.
“When you have for the first time in front of you this 3.1 billion-letter instruction book that conveys all kinds of information and all kinds of mystery about humankind, you can’t survey that going through page after page without a sense of awe. I can’t help but look at those pages and have a vague sense that this is giving me a glimpse of God’s mind.”
Collins joins a line of scientists whose research deepened their belief in God. Isaac Newton, whose discovery of the laws of gravity reshaped our understanding of the universe, said: “This most beautiful system could only proceed from the dominion of an intelligent and powerful being.”
Although Einstein revolutionised our thinking about time, gravity and the conversion of matter to energy, he believed the universe had a creator. “I want to know His thoughts; the rest are details,” he said. However Galileo was famously questioned by the inquisition and put on trial in 1633 for the “heresy” of claiming that the earth moved around the sun.
Among Collins’s most controversial beliefs is that of “theistic evolution”, which claims natural selection is the tool that God chose to create man. In his version of the theory, he argues that man will not evolve further.
“I see God’s hand at work through the mechanism of evolution. If God chose to create human beings in his image and decided that the mechanism of evolution was an elegant way to accomplish that goal, who are we to say that is not the way,” he says.
“Scientifically, the forces of evolution by natural selection have been profoundly affected for humankind by the changes in culture and environment and the expansion of the human species to 6 billion members. So what you see is pretty much what you get.”
Collins was an atheist until the age of 27, when as a young doctor he was impressed by the strength that faith gave to some of his most critical patients.
“They had terrible diseases from which they were probably not going to escape, and yet instead of railing at God they seemed to lean on their faith as a source of great comfort and reassurance,” he said. “That was interesting, puzzling and unsettling.”
He decided to visit a Methodist minister and was given a copy of C S Lewis’s Mere Christianity, which argues that God is a rational possibility. The book transformed his life. “It was an argument I was not prepared to hear,” he said. “I was very happy with the idea that God didn’t exist, and had no interest in me. And yet at the same time, I could not turn away.”
His epiphany came when he went hiking through the Cascade Mountains in Washington state. He said: “It was a beautiful afternoon and suddenly the remarkable beauty of creation around me was so overwhelming, I felt, ‘I cannot resist this another moment’.”
Collins believes that science cannot be used to refute the existence of God because it is confined to the “natural” world. In this light he believes miracles are a real possibility. “If one is willing to accept the existence of God or some supernatural force outside nature then it is not a logical problem to admit that, occasionally, a supernatural force might stage an invasion,” he says.
SOURCE: Times Online
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[dogmatorium]

Originally Posted by Robert A while back I read the book, "The 'God' Part of the Brain" by Matthew Alper and, with one exception, I thought it was a very good book. I think there exists a part of the brain that is responsible for our feeling that there is a godly presence about us. The evidence is pretty convincing in this regard. Stimulate a specific part of your brain and you want to pray, go to church, you have overwhelming faith, and feel the presence of God. Destroy a specific part of your brain and you loose your faith, feel no godly presence, and stop going to church. I believe this to be true. However, I don't think this necessarily means that there is not a godly presence about us. So, assuming the previous paragraph to be true, why would this God part of our brain evolve? How does it increase our survivability? The explanation the book gave was just very bad and wrong in my opinion. The book states that without our faith in God and belief in eternal life, the stress of facing death and non-existence would just be to great and cause us to die. This seems ridiculous since, because our death is so far away, we don't really worry about it that much, especially the younger people. Similarly, some people smoke even though they know it could be killing them. The consequence are just to far off to worry about. So, why did the God part of our brain evolve? Perhaps it increases survivability by giving us extra strength. To believe in something greater than ourselves gives a clarity of focus, extra strength, determination, and perseverance to accomplish our goals. However, I don't think this necessarily means that there is a godly presence about us.

I love this place

First , why when people say God they use the terms like "God" ?
If there's no God tell so how do we know that there's no God ...


while there's a minimum there's a maximum too
while there's life there's death too
while there's a winning there's a losing too
never,forever
heaven,hell
angel,devil
creatures of God,God the Almighty
smiling,crying,
abstract,concrete
fire,water
male,female
there's negative and positive side too ... etc


if spirit does not exist than feelings do not exist too
while we know that feelings [abstract] affects the part of body [concrete] too

Mind ? we do not see the mind so how do we know that mind do exist ?


some people ask how does God look like, and the answer is -who the feelings look like ? -

and some say -where's God-, the answer is -light the candle and tell me where the light goes ? [sure everyway so it is not left or right or up or dorn side but it's everyway]

this is our problem that we speak about God the things that we don't know about God !

one boy came and asked one muslim -does God exists ? If yes how does God look/form like ?
what is destiny/fate ?
how can devil burn in Hell while devil was created from fire ?

and the guy says - why did you hit me did I made you angry?
the muslim says - no you did not but this was an answer for the three questions.
the guy - I don't understand !
muslim - how do you feel now after I hit you ?
guy - pain
muslim - do you believe that pain exists ?
guy - yes I do.
muslim - so tell me the form of pain how does it look like ?
guy - I can't
muslim - this was my answer that we all feel the God even that we cannot se The God.
muslim - did you dream last night that I will hit you ?
guy - no.
muslim - this is my second answer for the destiny/fate !
muslim - my hand that I used to hit you on face , from what is created ?
guy - from skin.
muslim - do you feel still pain ?
guy - yes I do !
muslim - even if devil and Hell was created from fire ... the Hell will be the eternal full of pain for devil.

-------------

a lot of people think that The God and All-llah are not same

this is the same God of Abraham,David,Noha,Jesus,Moises,Ishmael,

same God of angels Gabriel,Michael ang devil Satan/Saytan etc...


[forgive me my english is bad]