[melanie]

Originally Posted by Mohan.C Melanie this is an amazing topic to discuss. It really is. If I offended you with my ideas then I'm really sorry. Please don't close such a beautiful idea and a thread. I hope this thread will officially open now. really looking forward to the next posts............

Thankyou,

mohan c and jak for the thoughtful and kind words.

It's not easy for me to put my idea into words, i do not intend to deface or devalue the wonderful, awesome, miracle we call life.....

I have got so much joy to share with people.

I understand my approach is sometimes a little insensitive, i am very sensitive, and the topic is a sensitive subject too.

Quite a sensitive cocktail LOL all in all.

mohan c i didn't mean to imply you were not welcome on this thread,
i'm a bit clumsy when expressing myself sometimes.
I am more than willing to answer and listen to all your questions and thoughts.

This thread is now officially reopened.

ps.. it's going to turn out good, if you just give me time to put it into words.
I have got so much time to give to anyone with a genuine interest.
You might be pleasantly surprised by what you discover here.



melanie.

[Dihydrogen Monoxide]

You're in a transition, or the transition for others, so you're going to be a bundle of paradoxes for a while. But so is a scout for the group. The scout encounters completely contradictory behavior yet because her group depends on it she must report all the madness faithfully.

[melanie]

Mohan.C If we are intelligence why is there a difference in it. It should all have been equal.

Mohan C

Just as no two finger prints are the same, a human is still a human.
A cat will always be a cat and a mountain will always be a mountain.
Differences expressed in human nature are 'apparent' only.
The human will never be any different from what it is. .. It will always be a human.
There can only be one intelligence/one source.
It permeates all life as the many, ''appearing'' as differences but in reality it is ONE having many different experiences from different perceptions.

Just as no two perfect snowflakes are the same, Snow is still Snow.

All 'things' although 'appearing' real are not really real, eventually 'things' wither and die.
It is Because 'things' die that they cannot be real, so they must be unreal. Only appearing real, Paradox.
What is real is unborn [AWARENESS] within which the 'things' appear and disappear IN.
AWARENESS must be the primal cause, and must have always existed.
"Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists.
AWARENESS It remains unaffected.
Though It takes the form of earth, air, water and fire and human bodies.
Though It takes all these forms,
It remains always the same.
Awareness is what we truly ARE .. and not the body. The body/matter is the vehicle for the spirit to express.
LIFE is an eternal expression, a dance of life powered by love for IT-self.
It 'appears' for the sheer joy of doing so.
IT is energy in motion = E-motion.

The self remains itself even when the energies of the world throw up endless diversities on the surface of the ocean of consciousness.
There are no independent entities in this world known as 'body' etc.
What is seen as the body and what are seen as notions,
the objects of perceptions, the perishable and the imperishable,
thoughts and feelings and their meaning all these are Brahman in Brahman, the infinite consciousness.
Brahman means ''CONSCIOUSNESS''

We form an identity based on the content of the mind
(feelings, sensations, hopes, dreams, thoughts)
however our true identity or nature is that which observes all of these things.
The seer, the witness or the Self.

[Dihydrogen Monoxide]

All there is is matter and forces. Shape and name are our own constructs.

Awareness is matter and force united observing itself which it cannot do without observing others.

Awareness can be asleep or awake. It is asleep when it must expend much effort or when expends little. It is only truly awake when it lives.

The greatest challenge is living when you must make no sound. When that becomes too great, society risks falling into sleep.

Therefore, resist before it all gets worse.

[melanie]

Originally Posted by JAK Melanie, your words seem to extinguish separateness, yet each word is separated by a space and by meaning. You seem to be leaning heavily toward MJA's theory of "=". If this is true, then in a universe without division, without separation, where does motion fit in? How is happy different from sad? How is a bird in flight different from a flower in bloom? And if there is no separation, why should we bother separating them by name? Thank you.

The concept and nature of ''Oneness''
Where the idea of opposites dissolve into No-thingness.
Or pure beingness. By it's very true nature all is Pure Beingness.
The concept of a 'you' 'appears' in this Beingness, Awareness, No-thingness.
But it is only ever an idea a concept. We are aware we are aware.
We separate 'things' by name by design to give 'apparent' meaning to life.
We personalize our 'apparent' existence.
Arising AS Self Consciousness.

When we look at a bird in flight or a flower in bloom, we are the awareness,
that is observing those objects, they are a projection of the Same One Self Awareness 'appearing' AS a different form.

The flower and the bird are not separate from that which is observing them [awareness] it is just a different expression appearing in awareness.
The many masks of the one face.
Both perceiver and perceived are one.

Consciousness -at-rest is not aware of Itself.
It becomes aware of Itself only when this sudden feeling,
I-am arises, the impersonal sense of being aware.
And that is when Consciousness-at-rest becomes Consciousness-in-movement,
Potential energy becomes actual energy.
They are not two.
Nothing separate comes out of Potential energy...
That moment that science calls the Big Bang, the mystic calls the sudden arising of awareness..."

[melanie]

=Mohan.C Really then why do some stars shine brighter. I think you are telling me to stay out of what I don't understand, meaning I think i'm not welcome in this thread. No problem.

I wasn't suggesting that you stay out of this thread, i was merely agreeing that sometimes even i have difficulties understanding some threads on this forum.
So i was relaying that back to you.
As you had stated that you couldn't understand my level of thinking.
''The some stars shining brighter than others'' was meant to imply differences of expression and appearance. Different Aspects of the Same Source.
Not levels of intelligence like you implied.

Mohan C If life is not to live but to just be then there is no meaning in relationship, no meaning to human emotions, no meaning to life itself, everything is nullified which means the essence of life is gone. Just stay like a stone. Don't talk to a person he is the same as you, he knows everything that you can probably know. No room for improvement no room for growth no room for width to widen a perspective. We are stuck inside a void it doesn't even have walls to make a hole and escape because it is nothing.

LIFE is being .. being LIFE .. it is most definitely living life to the fullest.
The emptiness of the void, is filled and is pregnant with infinite possibilities.
Manifesting As life .....
Oneness is not the end of every-thing .. it is ONE 'appearing' as every-thing.
Appearing to no-one, it is just appearing. All at once.
One without a second.
Appearing AS Our 'individual finite consciousness' an expression of IT-self.
As soon as we start to name 'things' as this and that we start to label and separate ''oneness''
It's how we've evolved, it's how we've been conditioned.
However, animals and nature are in a constant state of oneness at one with their environment.
And so are we, if only we relax our focus off of ourself the little 'i' or (ego)
We have taken on an identity aka the ego, so naturally we feel a sense of separateness from the rest of nature.
Awakening is realizing our true nature, which is beingness. Or 'I Am'
The ego always wants more and mostly spends it's time living in the past or future. Which doesn't really exist.
Except in the mind.
The NOW often goes un-noticed. And that is all there is.
We can give life as much meaning as we want, or nothing at all.
Eternal pure awareness is unaffected by the 'appearances' 'expressions' 'impressions' meaningful or not.

Even as heat is to a fire, whiteness to a conch-shell, firmness is to a mountain, liquidity to water, butter is to milk, coolness to ice, brightness is to illumination, oil is to mustard seed, flow is to a river, sweetness is to honey, ornament is to gold, aroma is to a flower. The universe is to Consciousness. The world exists because Consciousness IS And the world is the body of Consciousness. There is no division, no difference, no distinction. Hence the universe can be said to be both real and unreal: Real because of the reality of Consciousness which is its own reality, and unreal because the universe does not exist as universe, independent of consciousness.

[Dihydrogen Monoxide]

This is where I disagree.

It is a flaw in dualism which causes it to collapse (not dissolve). It is not the truth of oneness which causes the collapse. The flaw causes it. That flaw is talking about A and B without mentioning their difference. Our vocabulary is what does not consider difference. And so oneness asserts that the difference does not exist. But oneness uses the same deficient vocabulary.

To get to oneness one has to reach triadic reasoning. Then by recognizing common aspects and the necessity of common aspects we reach oneness.

The truth is:
oneness requires no collapse
awareness/learning is impossible without difference
it is necessary to point a video camera at a mirror to record the video camera, but then you can't see behind the mirror

science is the act of using two models (mirror and no mirror) to produce a complete picture, just like your two eyes produce conflicting images which resolve their conflict by producing the 3rd dimension

[melanie]

Originally Posted by Dihydrogen Monoxide This is where I disagree. It is a flaw in dualism which causes it to collapse (not dissolve). It is not the truth of oneness which causes the collapse. The flaw causes it. That flaw is talking about A and B without mentioning their difference. Our vocabulary is what does not consider difference. And so oneness asserts that the difference does not exist. But oneness uses the same deficient vocabulary. To get to oneness one has to reach triadic reasoning. Then by recognizing common aspects and the necessity of common aspects we reach oneness. The truth is: oneness requires no collapse awareness/learning is impossible without difference it is necessary to point a video camera at a mirror to record the video camera, but then you can't see behind the mirror science is the act of using two models (mirror and no mirror) to produce a complete picture, just like your two eyes produce conflicting images which resolve their conflict by producing the 3rd dimension

DM, i am very sorry but i haven't got any idea what's so ever,
of what you are talking about, in your post.

My understanding of oneness must obviously differ to yours.
Mine is a personal vision i am experiencing right now.
It is how i am seeing my reality. From my personal perception.

I am still left wondering if this thread was a bad idea,
as it is difficult to get inside and to understand other peoples minds.

To talk about oneness, must therefore be different and mean different things to each and everyone of us.

Best Regards melanie.

[JAK]

Originally Posted by melanie ... I am still left wondering if this thread was a bad idea, as it is difficult to get inside and to understand other peoples minds. ...

It's still a good idea, Melanie. Hang in with us.

Originally Posted by melanie ... Just as no two perfect snowflakes are the same, Snow is still Snow. ...

I think your analogy is key. If everything is relative, then the extremes are "at the poles". At one end, the end of extreme detail, every snowflake is different from every other snowflake. (Heraclitus taught us this.) At the other end, the end of extreme generality, every snowflake is just like every other snowflake and made of water. Like you said, "Snow is still Snow." (Parmenides taught us this.) Even more extreme on the generality scale is that a snowflake is a manifestation of energy.

Melanie, this brings me back to your use of "intelligence" which seems to be very broad in scope. (Sort of, "intelligence is still intelligence"?) What is included in "intelligence"? What defines it?

Thanks!

[Dihydrogen Monoxide]

flow is to a river - to you, melanie

cause means effect - to me

same thing (almost)

it's ok, we're here to learn no one thinks you've made a mistake posting

it's my favorite thread