[Dragongod]

It is said by current science that the Universe (matter, energy) was created by the Big Bang. Physicists describes the Big Bang as an explosion that released matter and energy throughout the vastness of space. This means that before the Big Bang, only space existed and anti-matter if you count that. Space is defined as empty (the absense of matter and energy) Obviously, a delima exist here. How is it possible that the absense of matter and energy (space) created or produced matter and energy (the Universe). It does not make any sense. To justify the Big Bang is to justify the logic that "something" can come from "nothing." This is logicaly not possible.

I guess this all fits in with the Uncertainty Principle which implies that at the subatomic level "virtual particles," also called quantum fluctuations, arise out of "nothing" into existence only to disappear, becoming "nothing" again. This, however, has never been proven-that quantum fluctuations actually exist.

I need some feedback regarding my overall logic behind why I dislike the Big Bang theory, i.e. prove to me that the absense of matter, mass, and energy (space) somehow has the ability to create matter, mass, and energy.

[force5]

I completely agree. IMHO, there is no room in our cosmos for nothing. And something can not come from nothing. I believe that there are two fundamental states of energy that represent the total volume/density.

1) Dark matter (stable)
2) Dark energy

The 5 percent of the universe that we can detect is of course normal matter. This portion of the universe will continue to decay until only DM and DE remain.

Oh yes, water is more dense than ice.

John

[Dragongod]

thanx. My theory is that if "nothing" can't exist than "something" always has to. That "something" would have to be matter and energy. That eliminates the possibility of people asking "well, where did that matter come from." You just respond it's not possible for something to come from nothing and therefore something(matter, energy) always had to be there. The problem is people keep thinking there was a begininng. It was always there, therefore its infinite. Then one day, due to the laws of attraction, particles came together and created an explosion. this fills in the gaps of the Big Bang theory. This theory explains the reasons for why matter is still expanding in the Universe and the problem with assuming that there was a begining. I can't find any flaws with it.

[wisp]

Dragongod

Your logic is good - something cannot come out of nothing. Something has to be there to make it happen.
But the current theory says that not even space existed before the big bang (BB). It says that spacetime came into existence at the moment of the BB. I don't accept this. I believe that everything in the universe was there before the BB event, and that matter arranged itself into a compressed state, which became unstable and triggered the explosion.

[Dragongod]

SO Wisp you are agreeing with my theory then. Thats great, this proves that there was no point of begining. The Universe is infinite, it had to always be there. No one can refute this because to refute this is to refute that we exist. To refute what we say is to believe that we exist from something that never existed. That obviously makes no sense and there we have to come from something that always did exist. And if guile wants to respond what is my empirical evidence, i will say it is: WE EXIST.

[Dragongod]

Maybe this should become part of TOE because it makes perfect sense.

[wisp]

Originally Posted by Dragongod Maybe this should become part of TOE because it makes perfect sense.

Yes, this is a good start point for the theory of everything. The current notion that the universe came into existence from nothing is illogical.

We can say that the BB is an event that happened in a universe that was always there, perhaps for an infinite amount of time, and is possibly infinite in size. But the question of why it exists is perhaps one that is too difficult to address at present, and possibly outside the scope of the quest for the theory of everything.

The key to a successful theory is to start with simple logical ideas and build on them. And if these ideas are original, that may be a good thing.

[Dragongod]

thanx wisp also in response it would have to be infinite in size because of the same logic "nothing can't exist." This means that the size of the Universe would have to be infinite. If it wasn't infinite then what would be there- it can't be nothing so it has to be the universe. Also aren't we answering why it exist by saying simply that it has to because nothing can't exist?
Also aren't ? starting wtih simple logical original ideas?

[force5]

The cosmos can be finite in volume. And I believe this to be the case.

When we think of expansion/contraction, it implies expansion/contraction of space/volume. I believe the universe is infinite in existence but finite in volume.

I believe that non-existence plays a very important roll in how the universe functions. Non-existence provides the conditions necessary to affect how energy momentum is determined.

[Dragongod]

well to answer you last question, yes, we do want people to know. If people know, then humanity will advance.

But about your thing of null sets. "nothing," when I use the term means something that has no properties, basically it doesn't exist-its the absense of existing. "Something," when I use it, therefore, means something that has properities, i.e. matter, energy, basically it does exist. To exist, by definition, means to interact witht he environment. Something that has no properities cannot interact with the environment, thus "nothing". Considering all this "The Universe" had to always be there, had to be infinite in nature, because we exist. We are proof that something had to always exist to create us. Existence cannot have a point of begining because that would imply that "nothing" existed before that point. The Big Bang is logically faulty because of this. If the scientific community would just realize that "The Universe" is infinite, things would be better.