Science 'versus' God?

[melanie]

...I will not be back!!


Mikal

Come back Mikal.



I'm with RP, it's all the same tail no matter how many times you tail it

Mikal, tell it like it is,you are correct in your own way,
perhaps your vibrations are pulsing at a higher frequency, could be difficult for some to tune into.

Ponder these links Mikal.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgNhMlKv4aA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4jdr...eature=related

[melanie]

Many claim to be dedicated to diverse spiritual realities and personal awakening. For most however, the brain, the ego, the pleasure centers, etc., do not want you fascinated with the idea of truth or waking up. Such a burning fascination would bring the demise of the brain, the ego, the pleasure centers, etc., as the personal thinking process knows them.

I agree that the truth will set you free, but to have a genuine, burning fascination with truth is very rare,...most people do not want the truth, they want useless happiness, and thus its mate, useless suffering. The realization of truth will bring the demise of beliefs, and the thinking patterns associated with those beliefs.

Today's human community cannot handle the truth,...truth is too profound to be consciously included in the lives people seek.

E = mc2 is a partial truth that many accept. Whereas mc2 < c is the fuller truth that most refuse to see; a truth in which everything (that means everything) can be understood through the cognition of that simple equation. All energy and mass is less than the speed of light. People however, cling to the idea of energy and mass as something real, something to be worship like the religious superstitions of their ancestors. The truth is that energy and mass is not real, nor does it exist beyond the dream of separation. Energy is simply the motion of mass seeking a relationship with its source,...a relationship it can never have, because the condition of separation cannot merge with the unconditionality of source. Wholeness is beyond the sum of opposites. The sum of opposites is their cancellation.

Every teaching of Buddhism points to the fuller truth of the above,...likewise, the Fourth Way philosophy (enneagram) points to the above,...and Maya and Bön Cosmology also points to the above. Yet even the adherents to those philosophies have not gone beyond their beliefs to see the truth. Most people, perhaps more than 99% of the world's population, are not conscious of even a single full truth,...nor do they want to.

People do not want to understand that the quantum process applies to humans as well as sub-atomic particles. They do not want to know that there cannot be a present or instant in time. The often expressed term 'present time' is an oxymoron. Neither science, religion, nor New Age philosophy desires to move beyond its own theories,...to have a renaissance like view of the patterns that weave our existence. So even though truth will set us free, few wish to let go of the desire of useless happiness, that they cling to for their identity, and to authentically embrace the truth. Most people do not want the "who that they think they are" to disappear. They desire to bring their conditions into the unconditional,...yet truth will never allow that to occur.

Excerpt from the book ... mc2 < c

[melanie]

True "Faith" is simply believeing in something you can't see.



http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=ucRuZ9lKM0s



http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=evfUTm...eature=related

[austintorn@aol.com]

FAITH, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel. (from D.D)

[melanie]

Not Knowing is the unknowing knowing known one with the knowing

From the unfathomable depths of silence comes all knowledge.
(as it ''arises'' it is known instantly,sensed, & imaged one with the knowing)
(all discoveries are already here in this conception)
Forever unchanged.
The cure for all our ills are already here, because ills are here.

Live by natures law and you won't get dis-ease you won't get uneasy.
(don't struggle to get past that horizon)
If we've got diseased it is because we've become separated from source.
We've become dis-at-ease (diseased)
Let the dead bury the dead.

In this conception.......
You will know what to do when you need to take act-ion, you will know how to re-act.
With- Automatic ordinary functional senses, aka the soul.

Though, What makes sense to my mind, may not necessarily make sense to another's mind, no worries there though,
we can only make sense from out of our own particular unique perceptions, because everyone's perception is different.

And yet it is the same ''One Spirit'' in all of us.

The same ''One Awareness'' permeating through and AS each entity.
We are the A-living & experiencing .... of this ''Conception''
viewed from our own particular unique ''self referential'' finite point/arena/angle of consciousness.
Just one simple page within the never-ending story book of LIFE
Changing ''images'' flashing in and out of existence. Forever unchanged.


We are the experiencing of ''THIS''
There is nothing to understand, ''TH-IS the understood''
And with that comes the peace that passes all understanding.

__________________________________


My cat has never got ill, he just looks at me and says .. ''shut up and feed me''

My cats vet thought my cat needed something to help it's depression.

Yes, apparently my cat was depressed according to the vet.

What they've not seen or even realized is..... my cat loves to chase the wind up the tree.

boy, can that cat play well hard,

i kept that knowledge under my hat of course, just incase they didn't believe me.....hehehe

[melanie]

In ''This'' nothingness all is hidden, in ''This'' same nothingness all is revealed.

A mountain cannot be any-thing other that a mountain and yet it is not even a mountain it is no-thing.

The color RED will always be seen as RED
every human eye sees the color RED as RED but no color was ever RED except in this conception forever unchanged.

There is neither being or non-being nor denial itself.

No evolution, except in THIS conception. Forever unchanged.
When a house of cards come tumbling down, where is that house of cards then?

It's right back to where it started from. NOW-HERE ....(Pure Awareness)

Check-out this baby ... http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=0kphsM...eature=related

Nice video that one.

_____________________________


In discussing the heart, we often mean the seat of emotion/intuition as opposed or complementary to the intellect.
What is important here is to see that both the emotions and the intellect arise from the same single source.
We could refer to this as the heart of hearts,
the central and true core of being-ness; an absolute and still no-thing-ness,
which escapes each and every attempt to grasp it with the mind.

See for yourself how absolutely impossible it is to form an idea of this no-thing-ness.
Every idea about it is some-thing and therefore not no-thing.
When the intellect tries to imagine this, it comes to a screeching halt.
This no-thing-ness is an impenetrable brick wall for the mind;
but for no-mind it is a warm bath, a coming home to the heart of hearts.

[austintorn@aol.com]

Oh Lord, Stars, ETs, Greg,

Save me from

Not Knowing is the unknowing knowing known one with the knowing

before it's too late and I become a know-nothing…

[melanie]

Oh Lord, Stars, ETs, Greg,

Save me from

Not Knowing is the unknowing knowing known one with the knowing

before it's too late and I become a know-nothing…

There is nothing to know,
knowledge on demand is ok like when driving a car.
It is automatic, and i don't mean the car.

LIFE .. IT is not an experience.
but the inexperience-able experiencing.

''You'' are the known part of consciousness, so no need to know that which is already known,
what is this that knows? no idea.


''You'' are a manifestation of consciousness, and have no independent reality, so nothing to save, you are quite safe and well at all times, no worries.

In this absence of the illusional independent self,

there is apparent functioning still arising, hearing,seeing,feeling, thinking,

Apparent body-ing and mind-ing,and world-ing... for no one.

A kind of to-ing and fro-ing in and out of id-entity....(Yank Back)
The entity arises in conjunct with senses sensed, self conscious.
Consciousness is always Self-Consciousness.
If you are conscious of anything,
you are essentially conscious of yourself.



On waking from your nightly dream, you did not worry that there was no-one in your dream to save you from your impending doom.

You woke up just in time to realize you are safe and well, much to your relief.

If you Believe this ''Waking Life'' to be real, you will be fearful, when you don't have to be.
It is real in the sense similarly as when we sit inside a flight simulator for instance, whereby our senses are tricked.
Although reality appears as real, it is mainly a trick of the senses...(illusional magic)
When we are lucid in this dream of separation, we can learn to direct the dream.
What we don't like we can change, just as you can have lucid dreams when you go to sleep, and direct your dream.

All change First comes from within ourselves, which we then project into the world.
If you don't like killing, don't kill.
If you like harmony, peace and love, be peaceful, harmonious and loving.
If something bothers you, remember this is just emotion, and it will pass over you like a cloud in the sky,
and it is not who you are, it is only appearing in you, and then disappearing again, it's what makes the dream appear real.



We attract and repel that what we do and do not like about ourselves.

Say if you are not liking or getting on with somebody.
That person is only mirroring back to you aspects of yourself that you do not like about yourself.

If you are loving and getting on with somebody really well

That person is mirroring back to you aspects of yourself that you too like about yourself.

This mirroring is nothing more that arising emotions/vibrations including,
jealousy, boastfulness, pride, kindness, rudeness, sadness, happiness, joyfulness, miserableness, etc, etc,
we project them outward.

It's what we call the law of attraction and repulsion.
__________________________________


I finally saw what had been in front of me the whole time but had been obscured by fear.
There is not only no individual self, but also no other.
No self, no other.
Everything is made of the same substance of vastness.
And...
The individual self is nothing but an idea of who we are.
Ideas are ideas and nothing more.
An idea can never be the doer or creator of anything,
it can only be what it is - an idea.

Collision with the Infinite
by Suzanne Segal. (deceased)

[austintorn@aol.com]

The Dreamer dreams the stable reality in which we operate, but this does not matter to us, nor need it be known, for not a thing is changed; the fake real being equal to the real real… unless some enjoy it less by knowing that it is fake…?

[Wick]

Come back Mikal.

Mikal has escaped the land of the manna eaters. Personally, I'm happy for her. All of us would be wise to follow her example. I think I'm going to. This particular debate is becoming stale and fruitless. See you all in other threads!!