East Meets West Logic...

[Lloyd Gillespie]

In an odd way .... This is capitalism .... and its successful for the very reasons you state. If everybody plunders, then it works ... because everybody adapts.

That is why I think we would be more successful controlling the buy price (the production cost) rather than controlling the sell price (retail)

cool bananas ... greg

Excellent suggestion, Greg...rrr

[SB_UK]

imagination

~s~

Sofi is an adventurer. I imagined her dreaming of places that would make her happy, like running through an open sunlit cornfield, or dreams of exploring through space.

Am trying to work out an argument which conveys the idea into all other's intuition *that* imagination can supplant the neural stimulation which people desire when they chase money in order to purchase the life of one of those (non-fictional wannabe) fictional rich people whose lives do not extend beyond the television screen.

~*~

Our current problem is the task of somehow reaching the understanding that those images are appealing to our imagination and that the feelings which people experience aren't understood correctly
- that they shouldn't be taken as the basis for emulation
- instead should be seen as evidence of the power of human imagination.

Why do movies entertain us when we all absolutely know that the screen is a fac5ade.
Why does a fac5ade entertain us?

The solution to this question will lead us to an understanding of ourselves which'll push us past the desire for physical possessions.

Note: How does one convince oneself (and then others) that the imagination (and nothing else) can keep on delivering and not become boring ?
Or are we attempting to arrive at a place where boredom leads to the 'end of mind' -
- a kinda' self-styled frontal lobotomy which places our mind in neutral (the daydream)?
Or are we trying to arrive at a place where the mind in daydream is capable of greater imagination which is packaged for consumption by our next generation.

That imaginative teaching practices lead to an increased speed and likelihood of development of mind (evolution of mind) -
- evolution (rebirth,enlightenment) of mind (the resurrection of Christ).

The ever more stimulated ascetic digital nomad
(our future)

The classic problem of mistaking Correlation with Cause and Effect
- if one were to purchase the Ewing Ranch
- one would not feel (in that physical reality) - as one would imagine - from the feelings experienced in the imaginary reality (the experiences felt whilst watching the television show).

That it's only a matter of time before and regardless of even in their lovely greater than 4 bedroom detached ranch with en suite bullcks -
- that the individual would (and in surprisingly little time) - that the individual would soon yearn for more.

Larry Hagman

muahahahhaaaa!

Q.E.D.

~*~

Attempting to suggest that the underlying mechanism of the mind
- of how it functions
may be understood if we concentrate on the idea described in this post
- the idea described in this post that as we live out our lives -
our ('individual') mind develops by a process of conformational change which through the iterative process of (constructivist) learning -
is under continuous conformational rearrangement -
- striving (ever) for a more energy efficient state (a global minimum)
==
the true basis of science
-> as ->
a model
- the simplest fully explanatory model of reality.

The simplest explanatory model of science, the mind and reality is (in all of these and more generally in ALL cases) the same
and
may be defined using a moving sound or picture or geometry
==
ToE

ToE (simply) is a statement of all of reality being an evolutionary variation on a theme -
- a variation on really so simple a theme
- we're victims of the confusion which arises through 'hierarchy'
- that the Stairway to Heaven scales.

- the idea described in this post that as we live out our lives -
our ('individual') mind develops by a process of conformational change which through the iterative process of (constructivist) learning -

- continuous conformational rearrangment which is serving to construct a model in which cause and effect (vertical associations) are distinguished (functionally separated) away from associative processes (horizontal associations) -

....|
vertical and --horizontal--> associations
....|
....v

which together lead us to the nature of the mind.
o
|
v
y -> x

Note similarity between this structure and the gravity -> electromagnetism transition.
o (gravity)
|
v
y -> x
(electromagnetism)

Noting (also)
o
- where Universal creativity and Human creativity (returning to LLoyd's thread starter)
- can be seen (in both cases) to apply to the capacity for the
underlying substrate (Western Science) (Universal creativity)
or
underlying consciousness (Eastern religion) (Human creativity)
~aka~
one God (Western religion)

- can be seen (in both (all three) cases) to generate seemingly (though not really) something from nothing- simply (instead) greater complexity from (relatively) lesser complexity

- the dynamic Koch curve expansion on wikiP hands us an image to imagine this process occurring to and by.

~*~

The mind is going to need (because everything (structure) needs by definition of its existence in reality (in whatever form)) to represent a single internally consistent model formed from the above (repeating) triplet alone.

The nature of the triplet changes (eg physics -> chemistry) - though not the nature of the nature of the triplet.
Explanation
Any given set of {mother, father and child} triplets are not the same in their nature (they have different names) -
- only in the nature of their nature (as mother, father,child).

The model (and not the specific instantiation) is shared.

(Note ref: Stabile
metamodel + data -> model
model -> metamodel on the next level down)

The logical structure of mind:
o metamodel
|
v
y+data -> x model

Noting the standing wave represents (standing motion) <- that's important isn't it? motion comprising a max peak and a min trough (duals) and evolution through its point of inflexion
~that is~
man + woman (duals) -> child (evolution through inflexion)
------> motion as the unidirectional evolutionary tendency ------>

Being human (development of mind) will be shown to be about imparting a model of reality within the local mind such that the framework formed from cranking through the triplet above
- in whichever domain of thought the individual happens to venture
such that the framework formed from linking the triplets connect.

Using simple English -
- the development of mind is a process which we are required to undertake and which we may understand us ourselves having completed -
- when everything kinda' makes sense.

When the general Systems level framework is built
- and not particularly when each and every of the many many nodes which exist within the framework have been labelled.

Using an image

We've bought a kit (consisting of only a buncha' identical looking bars) to build a geodesic climbing frame.




All struts are either in the x (associative) OR the y (cause and effect) axis.

Our goal is to construct a standalone structure
- the Systems approach
- where we've (as of especially recently) with the explosion of information ... ...
- where we've (as of especially recently) (with the explosion of information) found ourselves (our educational systems) delivering Molecular expertise.
~eg~
Systems Biology versus Molecular Biology

~*~

So - our problem has been that we've been developing overly complex sections of the child's climbing frame which aren't free standing
- won't support any form of play.

Where our goal
- species level goal 'd be best served by laying down the simplest form of standalone structure (so that it can (at least) be used by kiddy to have (at least some) fun)
- prior to making it

funner

.



... ... ... word limit exceeded... ... ...

[SB_UK]

... ... continued ... ...

Where our goal
- species level goal 'd be best served by laying down the simplest form of standalone structure ... ...

where our goal
- species level goal
even and much more so (I'm pretty sure as)
to
build
(and simply) that (at the barest of minima) -
- {*that*,the} simplest form of {the,*that*} standalone structure.

This form of cross-disciplinary expertise http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicenna

He was also an astronomer, chemist, geologist, logician, paleontologist, mathematician, physicist, poet, psychologist, scientist and teacher.

is unheard of these days -
- where 'everybody's some kinda' expert'.

~*~

In actual fact -
- the expertise which people use to fuel their own false sense of isolation from other individuals
- or rather the urge to separate self from others
- as -
evolutionary (an anachronism) in origins

(the memome trying its level best to be a dumba55 genome)
- the higher mental abstraction layer believing itself a lower physical abstraction layer,
itself to be

- where only through seeing through the legacy (and now useless) urge to bolster the ego
will we
as a species
gain
the motivation to move on
- to travel in the right direction

- the correct direction entailing that we simplify away the nonsense -
- leaving in its mass a core
- leaving in its mass a core of what really matters:

Gnome Chompsky and the Imploding Dwarves <


(mandatory reading)

- where the core of what really matters is for parents to develop a kiddy's climbing frame so that the lil' guys can have some fun
- so that the lil' guys can live a lil' ... ... ...

Hard to breathe in this current non$ense world (inspired by the misunderstood glamour of soap operas)
- of the pursuit of $elfish ignorant self-gratification.

- if one were to purchase the Ewing Ranch
- one would not feel (in that physical reality) - as one would imagine - from the feelings experienced in the imaginary reality (the experiences felt whilst watching the television show).

Life wouldn't be great and after a while, habituation'd lead to that familiar drearisome dull ... ...

Yawn!!!

A particularly evident symbol of the nonsense which we introduce into our lives :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummer



~*~

I really hate cars and around about absolutely everything to do with them.

The persona which the individual who aspires to purchase of one of those silly orange cars above has -
- is the persona of an individual who has so confused his abstraction layers -
- that he has no capacity to function in true reality -
- his life representing an attempt to force the world of imagination (where there are no limits) unsustainably into our physical reality
- where we're plain running out of stuff.

~*~

The irony (here) is that the criticism levelled at the current video gaming, sci-fi and fantasy generation is about to be turned on its head.
It's the people who're criticising current generations for their incapacity to get a 'real job' who're being (here) shown to hold a dangerously limiting view on reality
- one which leads to their insistence that their own children wreak further damage on a world which just can't take it Jim.

The increased capacity for abstraction (as observed in post-WWII generations) has delivered a group which appear to be functionally separated from precursor
- increased capacity to model reality (gained from need to assimilate entertainment) resulting in (because of the illogicality of parental dictat)
- their own minds (and without conscious intervention) ... ...
- their own minds rejecting that former way of life in favour of a more logical route (a more deeply logical route).

A more logical route which their parental set may not even be capable of understanding
- may not even be capable of understanding because of their definition upon a less complex structure of mind.

~*~

ADDF::Stabile ~paraphrase~
'Although the more complex structure of mind is capable of top-down thinking, it is more than capable of bottom-up thinking
(top-down + bottom-up -> big-picture thinking)

- the less complex model of mind prefers to delimit itself within artificial boundary -
a cocoon which it leads itself to believe (for reasons of simplicity though mostly need to control) ... ... ...
- a cocoon which it begins to believe *is* real.

~*~

Control -> the notion of control
- the oversimplification of reality which is expressed by lawyer and politician
- which permits the lawyer and politician to believe that they've the 'authority' to generate policy which others are then forced to follow

- the only mindset which could possibly ever (and which has predominated within legal and governmental organizations) may be shown to be of the less complex (more ignorant) conformation.

Anybody with the intelligence to understand the System would know that no human being regardless of the size of his drunks cabinet -
- can
ever
hope to make a difference.

So why even bother to try?
Unless (of course) it's nothing to do with making a difference
(which it is)
- the government/law are not, not even remotely interested in making a positive difference.

By definition of their 'mind' -
- they can't actually know (much as a 5 year old child could not know)
- they can not even
- are intrinsically functionally impeded in knowing how to make a difference.

~*~

Give me all your money; we are in control.

There is no control (at least at the level of the evolutionary tendency); at the level of the evolutionary tendency
- we're going to get to that place (speciation), for the most part (it seems) against their dullarded machinations.

Classified:Top Secret.
Do what we say - it's for your own protection.

... ... against their dullarded machinations.

and for why?
- because evolution of a basic substrate

one substrate
one God
one consciousness

is one process which we can be sure of, can be sure of since we ourselves are here now
- and had no part to play in the generation of the mind which we use to think
- which we use to think and confuse ourselves into believing is merely an attribute of the face we see in the mirror
- confuse ourselves into believing that it's a personal individual characteristic where the mind is (absolutely certain now) an emergent property at the species level.

That there is only one mind -
one mind which we all borrow from when we consider whether we're (for instance) going to eat a raw potato for dinner.

proletarian oiks rule!

[Lloyd Gillespie]

The Triadic Analytic Esthetic Geometry of Our Universal Emotions of Genericity's Simplicity__Dimensionality and Proportionality__From the Gentile, to the Projective, to the Factual...

Avicenna made it part way there... Kant made it a bit further... Peirce made it the furthest... We must finish the journey of the triadic whole__subjective/objective/ajective, or the, monojective/bijective/trijective minds' final journey...

Emotions, our most important essence, are much simpler than most have thought them to be__iff looked at, thoroughly, from and with the esthetic, analytic-synthetic a priori__The true triadic self...
(to be continued later...)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummer

... ... continued ... ...

where our goal
- species level goal
even and much more so (I'm pretty sure as)
to
build
(and simply) that (at the barest of minima) -
- {*that*,the} simplest form of {the,*that*} standalone structure.

This form of cross-disciplinary expertise http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicenna
is unheard of these days -
- where 'everybody's some kinda' expert'.

The mind is going to need (because everything (structure) needs by definition of its existence in reality (in whatever form)) to represent a single internally consistent model formed from the above (repeating) triplet alone.

The nature of the triplet changes (eg physics -> chemistry) - though not the nature of the nature of the triplet.
Explanation
Any given set of {mother, father and child} triplets are not the same in their nature (they have different names) -
- only in the nature of their nature (as mother, father,child).

The model (and not the specific instantiation) is shared.

(Note ref: Stabile
metamodel + data -> model
model -> metamodel on the next level down)

The logical structure of mind:
o metamodel
|
v
y+data -> x model

Noting the standing wave represents (standing motion) <- that's important isn't it? motion comprising a max peak and a min trough (duals) and evolution through its point of inflexion
~that is~
man + woman (duals) -> child (evolution through inflexion)
------> motion as the unidirectional evolutionary tendency ------>

Being human (development of mind) will be shown to be about imparting a model of reality within the local mind such that the framework formed from cranking through the triplet above
- in whichever domain of thought the individual happens to venture
such that the framework formed from linking the triplets connect.

Using simple English -
- the development of mind is a process which we are required to undertake and which we may understand us ourselves having completed -
- when everything kinda' makes sense.

When the general Systems level framework is built
- and not particularly when each and every of the many many nodes which exist within the framework have been labelled.

Using an image

We've bought a kit (consisting of only a buncha' identical looking bars) to build a geodesic climbing frame.




All struts are either in the x (associative) OR the y (cause and effect) axis.

Our goal is to construct a standalone structure
- the Systems approach
- where we've (as of especially recently) with the explosion of information ... ...
- where we've (as of especially recently) (with the explosion of information) found ourselves (our educational systems) delivering Molecular expertise.
~eg~
Systems Biology versus Molecular Biology

[labelwench]

For all of our observations and theorizations, there is nothing to point to as an unchanging absolute, except perhaps, change itself.

Constant transformation.

By what means is such possible?

And as the very framework by which we observe such transformation changes from moment to moment, The very logic which we apply in the analysis, is suspect as to veracity.

IT IS ALWAYS 'NOW'.

Every place.

Every time.

Regardless of how we 'feel' about the concept observed.

[SB_UK]

For all of our observations and theorizations, there is nothing to point to as an unchanging absolute, except perhaps, change itself.
Constant transformation.
By what means is such possible?

Star Trek, 2009
Scotty:

'Well I never
- of course -
space is itself moving'

The motion of our milieu as an underlying power source which is transduced into generate what we call reality.

We're the characters in a film discussing the projector camera reels which must move in order for us to be {here,there}
- can comprehend their existence without being able to venture into that space

... ... without being able to venture into that space
- much as the projected image cannot perturb the projector
- the projector representing {our,its,his} own self definition.

[SB_UK]

Emotions, our most important essence, are much simpler than most have thought them to be...

kinetic energy
emotion
motion
standing
potential energy
gyroscope

Emotions representing a motivation to be elsewhere because one imagines it'd be nicer there
- the evolution of kinetic to potential energy as the basis to emotion
- emotion as our internal sensor indicating whether we're there

- where we're there when 'no place else' appeals.

[Lloyd Gillespie]

Hi Lorrina, and yes what you state is very true, but how about I apply a logic of non-logic to emotions, which is no more than pure choice of actions__actions, when talking about personalities and attitudes, which are near infinite to our personal choices of such actions, as long as we some-wheres-near respect the parameters of others' actions and choices around us...? And all I'm referring to is the very change you speak of, but to fully realize we all have these choices of changes within us all, at all times__and it's only the times we forget this given-choice factor, that we may allow our bad emotions to overcome our good emotions...

I've seen so many people throughout my life, and at times this has applied to myself also, that did not realize they actually had a choice of feelings and actions, at any time they chose to realize it__But realize it, they/I did or could not. This is the great self-trap of emotions, many fall into and can not escape__It's the worst spot in the world to be in, and I well know about it, as I've fallen into that very spot more than once in my life__even though at earlier times I'd known of my free-will's abilities of choice of actions to escape, I'd become blind to that simple fact...

The mind is amazing, when it chooses to teach us lessons we need to know__and I only state this because, any of those times of feeling lost, were the greatest of self-teaching times in my entire life. So, I no longer fear changes and traps, as I realize they are also part of my journey of self-mind learning. And, since I wrote it down some twenty+ years ago, I no longer forget about it__but the spirit can still try to pull the wool over my eyes, when I may be least aware of it__but I usually just read my earlier material, and find my way home. It's not any different than when we were younger, and other friends associations may have temporarily buried our spirits, and we'd simply contemplate our way back to our own self's free-ground. It's just as one gets older, the path is more easily lost, and I'd recommend anyone writing down the simple mechanics of childhood memories of self-recoveries__because as many age, they get totally lost, and never recover their childhood spirits...rrr

For all of our observations and theorizations, there is nothing to point to as an unchanging absolute, except perhaps, change itself.

Constant transformation.

By what means is such possible?

And as the very framework by which we observe such transformation changes from moment to moment, The very logic which we apply in the analysis, is suspect as to veracity.

IT IS ALWAYS 'NOW'.

Every place.

Every time.

Regardless of how we 'feel' about the concept observed.

[labelwench]

how about I apply a logic of non-logic to emotions,
Originally posted by Lloyd Gillespie

non-logic is an acceptible term to use when addressing emotion.

Many times, the non-logic of emotion, will effect us to choose a destructive course of action, to ourselves, or others, and as such the consequences of a choice so made will seem illogical.

Yet, in other situations, an emotional response may be the choice of most who ever are faced by a similar circumstance.

It is observed that most people are going to grieve (emotion) the loss of a loved one.

Is the response of grief, then, non-logic, in your mind?

Our society is seemingly quite polarized in it's view of the appropriate measure of logic and emotion.

Persons who are too emotional, and conversely too logical, are equally shunned, as either state is uncomfortable for most.

I leave you with the thought that most men would rather be holding a grennade, with the pin pulled and 5 seconds to determine a satisfactory outcome, than to be in close proximity to an emotional female, especially if she is crying.

Most men are less fearful of a screeching harridan, than a little girl whose puppy they have accidentally run over in her view....

Unfair of me, I acknowledge, to introduce such metaphors of emotion.....

Your reply shall hold interest, I trust...

[Lloyd Gillespie]

The Triadic Analytic Esthetic Geometry of Our Universal Emotions of Genericity's Simplicity__Dimensionality and Proportionality__From the Gentile, to the Projective, to the Factual...

Avicenna made it part way there... Kant made it a bit further... Peirce made it the furthest... We must finish the journey of the triadic whole__subjective/objective/ajective, or the, monojective/bijective/trijective minds' final journey...

Emotions, our most important essence, are much simpler than most have thought them to be__iff looked at, thoroughly, from and with the esthetic, analytic-synthetic a priori__The true triadic self...

Emotions are the primary source of all the energies of our complete mind’s functioning, whether our animal fight or flight instincts, our most aesthetic emotions of compassion and empathy, or our higher emotional foundations under our intellectual and logical states of mind. We’re talking about our primary energy states in all these categories of choices of personalities, attitudes or medium to higher states of mind potentialities. Many have stated for centuries that this metaphysical state of primary energies could not be analyzed__But I see this, so far non-conceptual state of mind, as being analyzable iff we simply see its primary brain state function, before we apply content to it, as being fully possible of analyzability.

When the primary brain state is looked at, which would be our perceptions’ essence agents’ tools, whether passion, pain, reason, compassion, empathy, love, judgment or whatever other state may be involved, at the time of our action’s choices__is subject to nothing more than the use of the powers of this very primary energy. And when we are talking about any human energy source, we are simply talking about its capacity for good or bad, happiness or sadness, helping or hurting, loving or hating, on and on, yet it has and implies parameters of these mentioned choices and actions__which would be the proportionalities of energies applied to the many different situations we encounter. Just as a simple example; We may use our gentlest of emotional states of love toward another, with the least proportion of energy applied to the person our love is projected toward, even though this may take a tremendous amount of energy to control our will’s involuntary action, at the time__while at other times this state of low intensity energy may be a naturally flowing symmetry, often granted by what's outside our personal control of energy flows__The purely natural metaphysical flows. It’s still understandable as a low proportionality of energy applied.

On the other hand, we may want to excite another couple to a certain action for the day’s activities, and we’d apply a large proportion of energy, with our personality and attitude, to entice that particular couple to be enthused to bid our wishes, as we may have planned a very exciting outing, for everyone to enjoy, as I’ve often done, when bored of the atmosphere of the local area I may have been in. All I’m showing is the simple proportional emotional energy use we may have all applied at differing times in our lives. This would mean our basic epistemic agents of perception, as I see all essence agents, as being housed in perception, are actually acting through a geometric process of distributing energy to our willed actions proportionately differing at differing times and circumstances. Of course, this is just a simple explanation, but many are un-aware of the basic mechanics of pure emotional energy, and I think it’s very important to see all the varied dimensions of actions the emotional mind is actually capable of.

When one realizes it's simple energy choices, of actions’ choices, to control our emotions, we need never be trapped in our boredoms, excess desires or greed, because the free-knowledge-choices of actions is much more fun, than all the fulfillments of possessions could ever accomplish. A pure freedom of our mind’s actions’ choices, knowingly, is the most fulfilling of the spirit's possibilities__and is available to anyone who is shown this simple path__”Put the body in action/motion and the mind will follow.” It is no more complex than this simple statement. There’s no amount of possessions or money in the world, that can surpass the mind’s knowledge of its own freedom’s possibilities of free-will actions’ Possibilia. I’ve seen so many relationships go sour for the simple reason of not realizing the power of empowering the body’s actions, to have the minds follow, it's almost uncountable__and for no other reason than not knowing__The body controls the mind’s states of happiness__Do something__Anything__You’ll like it...

I’ve only offered a simple mind map of happiness’s possible actions, but imo, this is the fundamental state of The Triadic Analytic Esthetic Geometry of Our Universal Emotions of Genericity's Simplicity__Dimensionality and Proportionality__From the Gentile, to the Projective, to the Factual...rrr