East Meets West Logic...

[Lloyd Gillespie]

Our future is in the discussions of the possible models of the future__To achieve the desired natural communities, of satisfying everyone's yearnings, within a sensible environmental and resource sustainable process, or construct...

Get your tools out, and let's get to work...rrr

Atari...

Homer's willing...

[leskey]

Excellent posts, Lloyd.

Further to my PM, Lloyd, and since reading your posts today, here's a precis from De Bono:

A bigger danger than Climate Change is the poor quality of human thinking. Most of the problems, conflicts and fights in the world are caused by poor thinking.

The purpose of thinking is to enable us to deliver and enjoy our values. Values without thinking are highly dangerous and thinking without values is pointless - for thinking then has no purpose.

Thinking should be concerned with perception - not logic. Logic will never change emotions and behaviour. Human affairs is comprised of interactive loops - unpredictability. Perceptions control emotions. Emotions control behaviour.

Basic, traditional thinking software was developed by Socrates (argument), Plato (truth) and Artistotle (box logic). At the Renaissance the Church did not need creative thinking, or design thinking, or perceptual thinking (the Church being an institution that controlled all the answers). It needed argument, truth and logic and so this became the core of our thinking in culture, education and the operations of society (law).

Insistence on traditional thinking, does not make it more adequate.

Creativity and inventiveness never became a part of education. Argument, truth and logic proved to be excellent in science and technology. Though, excellent thinking in science and technology, does not carry over into other areas. Pride in our thinking (in some areas), results in complacency (in other areas).

Philosphers describe the world in concepts, perceptions and values. Philosophy and psychology are descriptive and analytical, but not operational and so, not practical tools for thinking.

We are privvy to new information over time. This means there comes a point where we can choose to restructure - this is creativity (this is the process of nature, as evidenced by our planet...and, the universe).

In a free-trade world the only differentiator is going to be creativity in the use of commodities to deliver new products, new services and new values.

The brain is a self-organizing information system that allows asymmetric patterns to form from incoming information.

Creativity is a different sort of logic. With normal logic, the universe is one of language or separate, discrete elements: like box, cloud, smile, etc. With creativity, the universe is that of a self-organizing patterning system that makes asymmetric patterns. Logic defines the rules of behaviour within this rather special universe.

In time with all self-organizing information systems, channels are formed: previous information strongly affects the way new information is received. There is a pattern whenever the change from one state to the next one has a higher chance of occurring in a particular direction, rather than any other.

I'll include a link posted in Pat's "An Idea"...it's open to your own interpretation: http://www.toequest.com/forum/101730-post4672.html

Shedding Light on the Cosmic Skeleton

Astronomers have tracked down a gigantic, previously unknown assembly of galaxies located almost seven billion light-years away from us. The discovery, made possible by combining two of the most powerful ground-based telescopes in the world, is the first observation of such a prominent galaxy structure in the distant Universe, providing further insight into the cosmic web and how it formed.

“Matter is not distributed uniformly in the Universe,” says Masayuki Tanaka from ESO, who led the new study. “In our cosmic vicinity, stars form in galaxies and galaxies usually form groups and clusters of galaxies. The most widely accepted cosmological theories predict that matter also clumps on a larger scale in the so-called ‘cosmic web’, in which galaxies, embedded in filaments stretching between voids, create a gigantic wispy structure.”

These filaments are millions of light years long and constitute the skeleton of the Universe: galaxies gather around them, and immense galaxy clusters form at their intersections, lurking like giant spiders waiting for more matter to digest. Scientists are struggling to determine how they swirl into existence. Although massive filamentary structures have been often observed at relatively small distances from us, solid proof of their existence in the more distant Universe has been lacking until now.

[labelwench]

After that thought provoking piece by Leskey, may I simply offer a visual and audio interlude of East meets West, to stimulate the senses and inspire further exploration of the path ahead....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAPZZ...eature=related

[SB_UK]

2. A peculiar (very pleasant) electrical wooshing feeling within the body (ADDf).
A very pleasant sensation which feels a little like the high one experiences the first couple of times one takes dexedrine.

We're evolving control over the facility to access that place.
That place is particularly special ... ...

The endogenous (sustainable,healthy) equivalent of the feeling which inspired
1 min 331/2 seconds - 1 min 35 seconds
in :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAHI3...layer_embedded

(A perfect match (without having experienced that particular drug))

-- the power of the moving picture.

~*~

great song

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlLWF...eature=related

~*~

Everybody knows

'The essential teachings of Hinduism'
p113

'the man who self-realizes ... ... has switched off the (former) propulsion
- desire.'

ved-anta
the end of knowledge
the end of physics
the end of desire

[SB_UK]

Excellent posts, Lloyd.

Further to my PM, Lloyd, and since reading your posts today, here's a precis from De Bono:

A bigger danger than Climate Change is the poor quality of human thinking. Most of the problems, conflicts and fights in the world are caused by poor thinking.

The purpose of thinking is to enable us to deliver and enjoy our values. Values without thinking are highly dangerous and thinking without values is pointless - for thinking then has no purpose.

Thinking should be concerned with perception - not logic. Logic will never change emotions and behaviour. Human affairs is comprised of interactive loops - unpredictability. Perceptions control emotions. Emotions control behaviour.

Basic, traditional thinking software was developed by Socrates (argument), Plato (truth) and Artistotle (box logic). At the Renaissance the Church did not need creative thinking, or design thinking, or perceptual thinking (the Church being an institution that controlled all the answers). It needed argument, truth and logic and so this became the core of our thinking in culture, education and the operations of society (law).

Insistence on traditional thinking, does not make it more adequate.

Creativity and inventiveness never became a part of education. Argument, truth and logic proved to be excellent in science and technology. Though, excellent thinking in science and technology, does not carry over into other areas. Pride in our thinking (in some areas), results in complacency (in other areas).

Philosphers describe the world in concepts, perceptions and values. Philosophy and psychology are descriptive and analytical, but not operational and so, not practical tools for thinking.

We are privvy to new information over time. This means there comes a point where we can choose to restructure - this is creativity (this is the process of nature, as evidenced by our planet...and, the universe).

In a free-trade world the only differentiator is going to be creativity in the use of commodities to deliver new products, new services and new values.

The brain is a self-organizing information system that allows asymmetric patterns to form from incoming information.

Creativity is a different sort of logic. With normal logic, the universe is one of language or separate, discrete elements: like box, cloud, smile, etc. With creativity, the universe is that of a self-organizing patterning system that makes asymmetric patterns. Logic defines the rules of behaviour within this rather special universe.

In time with all self-organizing information systems, channels are formed: previous information strongly affects the way new information is received. There is a pattern whenever the change from one state to the next one has a higher chance of occurring in a particular direction, rather than any other.

I'll include a link posted in Pat's "An Idea"...it's open to your own interpretation: http://www.toequest.com/forum/101730-post4672.html

Shedding Light on the Cosmic Skeleton

Astronomers have tracked down a gigantic, previously unknown assembly of galaxies located almost seven billion light-years away from us. The discovery, made possible by combining two of the most powerful ground-based telescopes in the world, is the first observation of such a prominent galaxy structure in the distant Universe, providing further insight into the cosmic web and how it formed.

“Matter is not distributed uniformly in the Universe,” says Masayuki Tanaka from ESO, who led the new study. “In our cosmic vicinity, stars form in galaxies and galaxies usually form groups and clusters of galaxies. The most widely accepted cosmological theories predict that matter also clumps on a larger scale in the so-called ‘cosmic web’, in which galaxies, embedded in filaments stretching between voids, create a gigantic wispy structure.”

These filaments are millions of light years long and constitute the skeleton of the Universe: galaxies gather around them, and immense galaxy clusters form at their intersections, lurking like giant spiders waiting for more matter to digest. Scientists are struggling to determine how they swirl into existence. Although massive filamentary structures have been often observed at relatively small distances from us, solid proof of their existence in the more distant Universe has been lacking until now.

Great post; the Western (perhaps all) educational system leave one feeling (regardless of grades) as though we're all missing the point.

The mind is built by scaling 'why?'
- built by the individual himself scaling his own structure as he sees fit.
We'll all get to the same place eventually -
the unique perspective which life offers though
- suggesting that an educational system which does not involve some strong element of student-directed personal direction
- will fail.

Knowledge is supposed to build and then cross-link; it's deeply dissatisfying to force a clump of knowledge into one's mind
- only to lose it when some other unrelated information is required to takes its place.

The Western educational system doesn't build a mind to think -
- it builds a mind which is capable of docile servitude in the face of increasingly over-complicated nonsense procedures in the workplace.

The core of the problem (so I've learnt) is :

/ \ versus /|\

| is the associative connection which builds the web (ADDF::Stabile metamodel web) structure of mind

- which fixes

'born slippy'

graphite sheets



into stable retention



...^........^
...|........|_ born slippy
...|
hard and fast

'born slippy' -> 'hard and fast'

- the exact geometric basis to the transition which must occur for the immature structure of mind to mature
- the mature mind which may then know 'creativity'.

Creativity representing nothing more than the capacity to make leaps in logic
(leap abstraction layers)
- make lateral connections
- to make lateral connections
- think laterally
by traversing the structure using the (orthogonal) novel path which that extra bond arrays into place.

| represents Hilbert's metalevel
- connects the basis of the evolution of mind (internal reality) (this post)
to
the evolution of abstraction layers (at the fundamental layer) in physics (external reality)
gravity -> electromagnetism

- connectivity between external reality and internal reality both evolving to the same basic geometric transformation
- both evolving to the same basic transformation (to elegant complexity)
- to the same basic pattern

- to the same basic pattern
because there is only one geometric process which applies to all of reality

~ ToE ~

'|s that would see'

[SB_UK]

A bigger danger than Climate Change is the poor quality of human thinking. Most of the problems, conflicts and fights in the world are caused by poor thinking.

Physical maturity
Mental immaturity

Mental immaturity
- cute in children
- deadly in adults.

Solution

simplify, simplify, simplify

- a task of extreme difficulty given our current culture of secrecy (patent law) -

- how does one go about simplification of a seething mass of secret unintuitive languages
put in place
to be {secret, closed, locked down, unintuitive, impenetrable}?

Is it worth the effort?

Perhaps simpler to allow the global economy to crash to spare us the ignominy of having to work out how to halt the private sector's affection for proliferation in vacuity.

www. argos. co. uk

You searched for

• VACUUM CLEANERS
• 220 results found

when one's already one in excess of our list of requirements

human needs

.
unreal!

A 'Barbie vacuum cleaner' for your little Stepford wife.

Make it pink and they'll buy it.

A mind constructed in absence of the metalevel perpetuates wide-eyed docility

- defines the mind which is capable of only docile servitude ...

- cute in children
- deadly in adults.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stepford_Wives

The term "Stepford wife", which is often used in popular culture, stemmed from the novel, and is usually a reference to a submissive and docile housewife.

A bigger danger than Climate Change is the poor quality of human thinking. Most of the problems, conflicts and fights in the world are caused by poor thinking.

Species-wide incorporation of the metalevel into our shared structure of mind (graphite -> diamond) represents the last task for modern man

... ... and back around she goes

~s ADDF~
Diamond vs graphite (from carbon) represents the former (i.e. a structure representing some higher energy component has coalesced into a more complex structure ... initial subcomponents settling into a lower energetic state)

- last task for modern man prior to post-

~s~ With fewer and fewer births and more elderly citizens, Japan could see its population fall 30 per cent to under 90 million by 2055, a government report said Wednesday.

[SB_UK]

The docile mind believes God looks like Tom Cruise in platforms and drives a Hummer.

cute in children
deadly in adults

Boards of Canada, 'One~source upon which all things depend'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xNts...eature=related

Everybody knows

1.The theoretical ergodic axiom of The West is absolute creator... one~creator
2.The theoretical ergodic axiom of The East is absolute mind... one~mind
3.The theoretical ergodic axiom of Science is absolute substance... one~substance

... ... ... and Everybody's correct.

... ... mini-doughnuts all round?

[racecar]

Now that's just plain "tomfoolery".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9J9KRZ0PnAs

WOW, now serving ?

[Lloyd Gillespie]

"Stare into the abyss long enough, and the abyss stares back at you." Nietzsche

Then it's all you see, and are... I choose the creative universal imagination toward possible future 'scientific' utopias__Come out of the woods of the past__There is a true middle way__Mental/Physical/Mental Maturity...!!!

The 'Natural Intelligence' Abstraction Layer...
Creative Universal Imagination...
Universal Ownership of Money...
A Natural Community Money System...
A Natural Community Law System...
Set Money Supply Incentive...rrr

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9J9KRZ0PnAs

Physical maturity
Mental immaturity

Mental immaturity
- cute in children
- deadly in adults.

Solution


- a task of extreme difficulty given our current culture of secrecy (patent law) -

- how does one go about simplification of a seething mass of secret unintuitive languages
put in place
to be {secret, closed, locked down, unintuitive, impenetrable}?

Is it worth the effort?

Perhaps simpler to allow the global economy to crash to spare us the ignominy of having to work out how to halt the private sector's affection for proliferation in vacuity.

www. argos. co. uk

when one's already one in excess of our list of requirements.
unreal!

A 'Barbie vacuum cleaner' for your little Stepford wife.

A mind constructed in absence of the metalevel perpetuates wide-eyed docility- cute in children
- deadly in adults.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Stepford_Wives
Species-wide incorporation of the metalevel into our shared structure of mind (graphite -> diamond) represents the last task for modern man- last task for modern man prior to post-

[Lloyd Gillespie]

Hi Leskey, great post. You've mentioned several points I'd like to expand on...

Excellent posts, Lloyd.

Further to my PM, Lloyd, and since reading your posts today, here's a precis from De Bono:

A bigger danger than Climate Change is the poor quality of human thinking. Most of the problems, conflicts and fights in the world are caused by poor thinking.

Couldn't agree more...

The purpose of thinking is to enable us to deliver and enjoy our values. Values without thinking are highly dangerous and thinking without values is pointless - for thinking then has no purpose.

Exactly, precisely put...

Thinking should be concerned with perception - not logic. Logic will never change emotions and behaviour. Human affairs is comprised of interactive loops - unpredictability. Perceptions control emotions. Emotions control behaviour.

Let me enter here, again, my diagram of perception so you may see and know how much I am in agreement with you...

As you can see I've represented all essence agents as existing inside perception, and my view is that no values of any essence agent function properly, without processing through all the essence agents, as these essence agents, whether emotions, reason, logic or whatever, iff not used in conjunction with each other, perform rather poorly(modern mans greatest mistake_processing out of conjunctional assistence from the total tools of perception). This is why I have all the double ended arrows linking the best function of all our essence agents within perception. Since my scientific view sees nature producing all living beings and creatures, which in turn produces brains within living creatures, which would produce our physical brain's perception agency, this would produce our minds and knowledge, which would be just as Socrates stated about knowledge being perception. This makes mind rather easy to understand, and is in line with hundreds of the newest epistemic studies, I have on pdf files in my computer, by many male and female epistemologists, which are in agreement with Socrates, to Ibn Sina, Peirce and myself...

Basic, traditional thinking software was developed by Socrates (argument), Plato (truth) and Artistotle (box logic). At the Renaissance the Church did not need creative thinking, or design thinking, or perceptual thinking (the Church being an institution that controlled all the answers). It needed argument, truth and logic and so this became the core of our thinking in culture, education and the operations of society (law).

Total agreement here... Both Ibn Sina and Peirce thought Socrates to be the original pragmatist, though Ibn Sina used the language of his day, to state the similar...

Insistence on traditional thinking, does not make it more adequate.

Exactly...

Creativity and inventiveness never became a part of education. Argument, truth and logic proved to be excellent in science and technology. Though, excellent thinking in science and technology, does not carry over into other areas. Pride in our thinking (in some areas), results in complacency (in other areas).

Again, total agreement...

Philosphers describe the world in concepts, perceptions and values. Philosophy and psychology are descriptive and analytical, but not operational and so, not practical tools for thinking.

And here I'd have a difference of opinion, as certain philosophers, especially a few newer men and women, are seeing the importance of values being very necessary to a proper philosophy and thinking, as did Socrates, Ibn Sina and C.S.Peirce. As a matter of fact, much of these author's material states just these facts__But I agree, one must be very discretionary as to which philosophers or any others to listen to__There are actually a few good ones, who realize values added to all philosophies/psychologies, is the only way forward...

We are privvy to new information over time. This means there comes a point where we can choose to restructure - this is creativity (this is the process of nature, as evidenced by our planet...and, the universe).

Again, exactly agreed...

In a free-trade world the only differentiator is going to be creativity in the use of commodities to deliver new products, new services and new values.

And I also agree that it must be the creative universal imagination with values added, that must be used in all our future diliberations of new community endeavors, based in sound imaginations and reasonings with these real values added, for a true change to ever even be considered...

The brain is a self-organizing information system that allows asymmetric patterns to form from incoming information.

Yes, definitely...

Creativity is a different sort of logic.

With normal logic, the universe is one of language or separate, discrete elements: like box, cloud, smile, etc. With creativity, the universe is that of a self-organizing patterning system that makes asymmetric patterns. Logic defines the rules of behaviour within this rather special universe.

I have the same view of what you state...

In time with all self-organizing information systems, channels are formed: previous information strongly affects the way new information is received. There is a pattern whenever the change from one state to the next one has a higher chance of occurring in a particular direction, rather than any other.

And this is what the first diagram I posted on my philosophy thread is all about. LINKThe depth of my argument within this diagram is about how small concepts merge, to become new and larger, more important concepts__and also how metaphors, lucid visions, imaginations, and epiphanies are processed within perception, into the all important new ideas__This, imo, with be our future salvation of life path, or as R.Rorty put it; 'Our redemptive truths of future possibilities...'

http://www.toequest.com/forum/general-philosophy/4685-false-true-philosophical-utopias.html#post95661

Had to pare the end down a bit due to word count, but am familiar with the post, and am intrigued at how complex the universe is turning out to be__But I do see simplifications showing up in this very complexity

Thanks again Leskey, for a very informative post...rrr