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01-22-2008, 08:45 PM
|  Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluent Piffle  Ah, that's good. I'd hate to think you might have 'lost it'! 
But then, didn't you just agree with me?
pif. | I will always agree with you pif,unless I am unable to of course!
regards michael.
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01-22-2008, 08:51 PM
| | Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick I will always agree with you pif,unless I am unable to of course!
regards michael. |
Well, in that case, do you agree that this question... Quote: |
Why did you just present a one-sided 'never' approach to the concept?
| ...has just been ignored? Or shall we say 'misaligned'?
pif.
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"The sense of threat from every quarter of what is known as the Establishment – which is to say, of modern civilization – is not altogether a put-on or an act for many of these young folk, but an actual condition of soul. The break-off is real, and what is being bombed and blown up outside are actual symbols of interior fears." - Joseph Campbell
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01-22-2008, 08:55 PM
| Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluent Piffle Well, in that case, do you agree that this question... ...has just been ignored? Or shall we say 'misaligned'?
pif. |
Ignored most likely!
thanks pif,michael.
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01-22-2008, 09:01 PM
| | Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick Ignored most likely!
thanks pif,michael. | And would you say that ignorance was an attribute of 'consciousness'?
pif.
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People look after the things they have affection for. It is thus essential that we learn to have affection for the planet that sustains us.
"The sense of threat from every quarter of what is known as the Establishment – which is to say, of modern civilization – is not altogether a put-on or an act for many of these young folk, but an actual condition of soul. The break-off is real, and what is being bombed and blown up outside are actual symbols of interior fears." - Joseph Campbell
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01-22-2008, 09:10 PM
| Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluent Piffle And would you say that ignorance was an attribute of 'consciousness'?
pif. | Accepted ignorance is an attribute of wisdom,only the fool knows!Consciousness is
made known to us by our ability to understand the pressure arising within us.
regards michael.
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01-22-2008, 09:19 PM
| | Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick Accepted ignorance is an attribute of wisdom,only the fool knows!Consciousness is
made known to us by our ability to understand the pressure arising within us.
regards michael. | You feel the pressure do you michael?
Good time to leave it there for tonight...
Have fun!
pif.
__________________
People look after the things they have affection for. It is thus essential that we learn to have affection for the planet that sustains us.
"The sense of threat from every quarter of what is known as the Establishment – which is to say, of modern civilization – is not altogether a put-on or an act for many of these young folk, but an actual condition of soul. The break-off is real, and what is being bombed and blown up outside are actual symbols of interior fears." - Joseph Campbell
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Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7,738
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01-22-2008, 09:27 PM
| Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluent Piffle You feel the pressure do you michael?
Good time to leave it there for tonight...
Have fun!
pif. |
Good night pif,sleep well/
regards michael.
__________________
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01-23-2008, 05:31 AM
| | Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
...only the fool knows! Consciousness is
made known to us...
| 
You seem to be calling yourself a fool, michael?
pif.
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People look after the things they have affection for. It is thus essential that we learn to have affection for the planet that sustains us.
"The sense of threat from every quarter of what is known as the Establishment – which is to say, of modern civilization – is not altogether a put-on or an act for many of these young folk, but an actual condition of soul. The break-off is real, and what is being bombed and blown up outside are actual symbols of interior fears." - Joseph Campbell
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Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7,738
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01-23-2008, 07:36 AM
| Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fluent Piffle
You seem to be calling yourself a fool, michael?
pif. | Prehaps I thought that if I do it first,it will rob you of that pleasure later?
regards michael.
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01-23-2008, 09:31 AM
| | Re: Noumena = Is-ness=less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick When I first heard the expression "reality just is" I said is what! IS, is the noumena, unexplained, but instead "realized" from within, a rising up from within the universal ocean of consciousness,and downloading via the non-physical mind, into the physical brain. | Dear Michael ....
You and I both ' Know' that the two squares 'A' and 'B' are not the same colour ... its obvious ... no amount of viewing, or peering can convince my consciousness (nor yours, nor anyone else's) that they the same colour. look at them as close, and for as long as you like. This is the Noumena's interpretation 
And yet, despite our conscious knowledge (Noumena) of this, Science (Phenomena) can quite easily prove they are the same colour. We have to ' Realise' this
This is a drawing from the Wiki and can be found by clicking here, no need to trust me. You can prove it to yourself by following the link. Or you can view it below where I have painted a colour band across both squares using the exact mix.
Our conscious awareness can not always be relied upon. This is a simple proof, things are not always what they seem, despite how they appear.
Our eyes don't lie, they are not the guilty ones responsible for the mis-interpretation, our Noumena is. It makes a mistake in detail, confused by the shadows. Sometimes Phenomena is more reliable than Noumena.  Quote:
Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick IS, is about understanding that reality cannot ever be explained, only realized from within the soul/mind. We are Noumena, we are IS, our task is to understand fully what that means, then find the way to individually realize this for ourselves,and make it our personal-impersonal reality! | No amount of realising could show that they are the same colour, the true 'reality'. Without an understanding of the phenomena of colour the noumena would always be incorrect. Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert ... Our fearless Leader, who is never ever wrong I would say that noumena is a property of a thing that cannot be perceived by our senses. A thing is, ( greg's emphasis... ) in reality, different from what we perceive it to be. The phenomena then is how we experience the thing through our senses. | Quote:
Originally Posted by Graybeard Limitations of Noumena
Our biological limitations of perception and judgement of our physical world need to be understood so we can know the noumena beyond our senses and the fallacies in our judgement.
Our biology determines how we accept or block new ideas, thoughts, and the very paradigms needed to understand reality at its deepest levels.
We must overcome our physical and psychological limitations to successfully pursue the Theory of Everything. The Theory of Everything will explain the biological basis for human cognition, consciousness, perception, emergent behavior and much more
[Source Unknown to me] | cool bananas ... greg 
Get with it you pommy, your losing the plot. I'm going to thrash you in the upcoming exam... easy .... rotflmao 
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