[mkirkpatrick]

The quest for the toe,to reveal the path that leads to the understanding
of everything,is a noble task,I consider that looking into the absolute gulf
of noumena and its accompaning ISness will somehow open the gateway
to further understanding of this cosmic truth.

Although we may never grasp the noumena,we will realize that we are all
firmly anchored within it,and that we are phenomena on the surface,but
noumena at depth.

With access to cosmic consciousness coming online "so to speak" to those
who have through effort opened their minds to a greater depth of consciousness,who have contacted their soul and have downloaded
expanded consciousness into their minds,there comes the realization that
we are all one in another,and are in effect IS manifested?


Through that which is seen phenomena,we become aware of the unseen
noumena,and as our insight grows,so does our understanding of this great
sequence unfold,as does the lotus before the rising sun!

tbc

regards michael.

[bottomlander]

Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick ........ Hope this helps my friend. warm regards michael.

Dear mkirkpatrick,

Glad to have your help and clarification on IS.

As stated in my last post: "I have to admit that I read too little articles/books on philosophy and metaphysics. For months, I felt my incapacity as a layman when I saw the term 'IS' frequently appeared in your postings."

I have to admit also that I am very slow in learning new things. Unlike many people that can digest readings/information with quick speeds and write very quick, I seldom read things unfamiliar to me. Anyhow, thru reading your postings, I appreciate your "first hand personal experiences", "try-our -best details and steps" with developments on philosophy and metaphysics.

I think scientific methods try their best to give definite answers. Yet I read elsewhere that metaphysics provides some helpful methods for "internal and cosmic enquiries".

I appreciate details and steps during enquiries and trials-and-errors rather than hasty conclusions.

Best Regards. Bottomlander

[mkirkpatrick]

This thread is attempting to decend into the very heart of being,to find the the very base
that all else is based upon,the noumena is the baseless base that all originates from
and returns too,all though this may sound very Zen-like,a koan,of the baseless base,it
is I feel very apt,and a fitting description of that which is indescribable.

The journey from that which IS to that which appears as form,is a long one,
longer still for us who have attained self-conscious awareness,and can ask
the questions,who am I,what am I,where am I,how did I get here etc,we
have the unique ability to ask and question,but from where will come the answer,to these endless wonderings?One place where the answer can be found is within each and everyone of us,look deep within yourself,ask yourself
the question,who am I really?Ask with patience and trust,if you persist the answer will come,it always does,it cannot fail,because you and I are the very
embodiment of reality ITSself,don't take my word for it,don't take anybodies word for it,but hopefully you will take YOUR-OWN word for it.

We have ventured out from the womb of noumena and were born into the
phenomenal universe that we are learning about today,gradually as the
aeons slip away we will consciously be able to make that quantum leap in
consciousness that will allow us full conscious entry back into noumena
and home.

Noumena is not a theory,rather it is an experience that we all go through
and return to,it is a living reality,it is about who and what we are,really are
that is!We experience this reality each in our own unique way,as we journey
within ourselves,vast areas of previously unknown levels of consciousness
open up before our very eyes,we become amazed at the very great depth
of our being.

Theories,postulates,conjectures,are ideas that could or could not actually
relate to the real sequence of life itself,but,we are life itself! We are NOT a
theory,we are the very embodiment of reality,we are the visible tangible
evidence that we each experience PErsonally,we are IS,we are Noumena,we
are Phenomena,we are life expressed within a theatre of relativity showing
and playing within a relative universe,whose whole ultimate purpose is still
shrouded in mystery,but wow,what a great surprise it will be!

However deep life is,we are anchored firmily within it,right down to its absolute depth,we may well "bob up and down" on the relative surface
of phenomenal existence,but we can never sever our inner-noumena
connection.

Life is experienced through our consciousness,senses,personal awareness,
our interactions with others,we learn from each other,and begin to see many
similarities between us,we experience "mirror imaging" and "see" reflections
flash forth between us,in particular when we exchange energies in passions
arising,and emotions inflamed.


When we begin to look within and less than without,we see connections
and feel a magnetic tie in with all and life expressed,we instinctually understand that there is a "golden" thread that unities us all together,as
one,the "I" of the ego loses its grip,and for a while we can feel as though
we are loosing ourselves,which causes fear to arise,and uncertainess to
be felt,this very real feeling however does pass,and a new depth of consciousness and understanding is reached.

regards michael.

[N0B0DY]

"Noumena is not a theory,rather it is an experience that we all go through
and return to,it is a living reality,it is about who and what we are,really are
that is!"

You're an intelligent individual, Micahel, but I think attempting to define noumena is like me trying to define the non existence within the existence that doesn't exist. lol

We keep hitting roadblocks, that aren't there, I think because the noumena is not based on the experiential. The experiential is based on phenomenal experiences, whereas the noumenal is the cause of the phenomenal.

What I was trying to uncover with RP is that if it is the infinitesimal that we are referring to as the cause for phenomenal experience, that infinitesimal functioning is phenomenal as well - only at lesser and lesser scales, ad infinitum and nauseam. He had mentioned shperes within spheres within speheres, and I would not categorize these fractals as being related to noumena.

I guess in past times, suggestions of creatio ex nihilo were attempts at giving a cause to the cuaseless, but we both know that literal things can never be created from nothing. So perhaps we just have to hang loose like a goose on a noose.

[mkirkpatrick]

I value your comments NOBODY,and yes it is impossible to describe
the indescribable,but hey,why should that stop me!The noumena is us
at our indivisible unknowable essence of beingness-life ITSelf,where you
and I no longer exist as such.


I suppose what I am attempting to do,is to bring to the self-aware consciousness of our being,the idea and "seed thought" of percieving
our birth into the physical universe via the portal of noumena's protyle
atom.

This being an experience,that we can all tap into,and becomes our common
heritance.Rather than a theory,we find it within our being and re-cognise
as "this is so"!


Also too hoping that the "seed though" will bare fruit and blossom into a harvest of realization of the inclusivity of life,and our inheritance of it,which
in due time will profoundly alter the way we see and do things to each other?

That which we are,is realizable to us through a series of minor and sometimes major
conscious awakenings,an expansion of our consciousness level of perception,if we practise
a daily mental discipline such as yoga,and meditation,this opportunity to expand our level
of conscious awareness will present itself much more often.

Noumena is the birthplace of potential,becoming realized and being made formal(shaped by intent)and given motion,form,and spin,by the will.

We surface within this infinite ocean of consciousness,become self aware
then begin to wonder who,what.and where,we are.
We unfold exactly as a flower unfolds,although our unfoldment involves a
more diverse depth and radius than the humble flower,we are anchored
firmly with our roots embedded within that dark place(the noumena)just as
the flower has its roots firmly held in the dark earth below.

On the surface of our conscious awareness we are within a physical environment,and living upon a physical world/planet earth.That is what we are on the surface of our being,but there is an infinite layer upon layer beneath
that formal surface,each has its corrosponding level of perceptive consciousness,we are far deeper beings,than it is possible at this stage in
our unfoldment to yet fully realize.

Consciousness has a voice,and that voice will relate to us if we but listen,
how many times have we heard the injunction"listen to that still small voice
within"this "voice" of consciousness relates back through all layers and
dimensions of being,right back in fact to our birthplace with the noumena
itself.

On the surface this acts like the voice of our conscience,a monitor within
that tries to steer us along the path of least resistance,thereby incuring less
karmic debt.

However this "voice" has unlimited depth,and will if asked reveal the journey
you have undertaken so far.It is all expansive,and all inclusive,and is there
for you when ever you feel able to make earnest and sincere inquiry.

regards michael.

As said previously on this thread don't take anybodies word for it IS-ness-less
certainly not mine,but listen to yourself,inquire within,can I relate to this?
Is this really me at depth,am I the embodiment of reality? If you perchance
hear no,then reject all that is said here,and drop it as one would a hot stone.
But should perchance you recieve an affirmative reply to your earnest inquiry
Then it behoves you to enquire further from within yourself.


The greatest sickness that befalls mankind,is that of separation from the whole,a separation of relative ignorance and limited understanding of the
inclusive nature of reality.

Understanding our heritage and our linking it to the noumena,unites all
of us together,the whole physical universe into one homogenous whole
all acting somewhat differently,yet all claiming kinship with one another.


As we reflect on the issue of beingness,the deeper we probe the greater will be the
response or echo of returning energy,a wave of confirmation,an expansion of conscious
awareness,will be the reward of the earnest seeker of beingness.


The reflective principle of course works both ways,it just appears at times that we only
reflect that of the outer physical world,and prehaps there is an unbalanced and general
lack of perspective using of the inner reflective principle,why this is,is anybodies guess.


The noumena calls us from deep within our very heart of being,that vast infinite void
within beckons us and waits patiently for us to "wake up" and respond to the call to being.

When we do respond,a great gulf of awaiting consciousness is "reflected" into our minds
and a new understanding dawns upon us.


tbc

regards michael.

[MJA]

Hi Michael,

Here's a nice quote for "thyself."

Resolve to be thyself: and know, that he who finds himself, loses his misery." Mathew Arnold

=
MJA

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by MJA Hi Michael, Here's a nice quote for "thyself." Resolve to be thyself: and know, that he who finds himself, loses his misery." Mathew Arnold = MJA

Hi MJA,fine quote,here's another,in the land of the blind,the one eyed man is king!

enjoy your day


regards michael.

[mkirkpatrick]

A take on the word noumena;

No-thing
Opens-up
Universal
Manifested
Energy
Naturally
Abounding=NOUMENA.

From out of the no-thing comes the "appearance" of the "all things".IS-ness-less as it is
when it is "un-thinged"?

Balance of being,are any of us really balanced?What does it mean to be balanced? We are
as far as one can ascertain three fold beings,mental,physical,spiritual,supposedly if we
were in a perfect triple harmony then we would be most fluid and dynamic!

A deep inner calling,prehaps from the noumena itself,seems to pressure its moulding (us)
into being authentic,real,spontaneous,to act without the process of thinking about it,to act
rather than re-act.

It is said,that those who live within a balanced inner and outer life,attract more sychronous events into their lives,as though the universe aknowledges kinship with
them?

Deep down we all want to be true to ourselves,and to "others",however that requires
effort on our part to find out from within ourselves,who we "really" are,as opposed to
who we think we are?

The Intentional wave that eminates from the portal of noumena to bring about relative
cohesion to matter energy fluxuations throughout the physical universe,relies upon the
twin spinors of Ying and Yang to provide polarity and balance.

We too are part of this equation,and need to relate to a quest for external and internal
balance,energy that flows through us and around us needs coordination and symetrical
flow if we are to remain healthy and "relatively" fit?

To begin to deal with this task,we need to gain understanding of our true being,to open
our hearts and minds to possibilties that sound scary and wonderous at the same time
and to share these awakenings with friends and family,thereby growing in a cordinated
and balanced way.

regards michael.

[MJA]

Ask yourself this "Is" question: Is this it?

=
MJA

[mkirkpatrick]

The grand universal law of correspondence causes an echo to arise within us,resulting in
an inner knowing "that it is so",it is beyond the intellect,it lies within the very core of being,(the soul of self conscious awareness)When this resounding occurs,from say a deep
meditational inquiry,we then "know" that we have linked into the very core of our being-
the "IS" that lies beyond the portal of noumena.

Correspondence is a universal law that ties in with and is closely associated with that
of sychronicity,when we find a noticable level of correspondence and sychronicity occuring
within our lives,we can be very sure that we are on the right track.

Reality surfaces within us,and we become tangible beings,always though deeply connected to that invisible intangible source of beingness the "IS" itself!

We are so very much more than we could possibly imagine,we live our lives upon this relative plane of existence,what we exhibit in the physical relative sense is only a tenth
of our true being,we are much like the iceberg that has a small visible surface,of which
nine tenths are hidden beneath the waves.

What wonders await our discovery beneath this visible body standing now before us?
That wondering is I feel a call from the deep,to invite us to claim kinship with our whole
being,rather than just a small portion of the whole.Who then among us will answer that
call?

Deep down in the centre of our being there is calm,perfect peace,on the surface though
it is a very different story,storms and squalls blow in as we become fired up with emotional responses to outer stimuli,our tempers and feelings blow hot and cold.

Without a firm anchor,we could so easily be swept away,and loose control completely,
and then regret a violent action for the rest of our lives.

We all have course have this firm anchor within,the problem occurs however,because so
many fail to realize what they "have on board"and consequently "feel" adrift with no inner
or even outer support,apart from drugs and alcohol,many of these sadly are nursed in our
hospitals.

We all have a basic need to feel safe,protected,loved,and somewhat cared for,remove all
this,and have no faith in a God,or some Spiritual being,then you have a recipe for emotional and mental damage.

An old master said to me many moons ago now,when I inquired what could I do?He simply said,"pass on all you are aware of,and walk on"That is all any of us can really
do,pass on what we have learnt,and continue to learn.

We have all an anchor that holds us firmily,and ultimately will never fail us,we just have
to realize this simple reality,and go forward into life with confidence,and unafraid.

That which Is we Are,is a simple profound statement,but is it so?Is that a statement of
reality (as it is ness)or simply a statement of wishful thinking?Or even delusional mis-guided thinking?

Of course I accept the first premise,that which is,We are,now the reason I accept this is
because of corrospondence from within,an affirmative response to the question,"Am I
part of that which Is",not because I read it in a book,(and of course I did)not because
some master or other person told me so(which they did)the only reason I accept this
premise,which for me is a reality is because I found it from within my being,which of
course is indelibly linked and tied into the IS.

The simple beauty of this to me is that you find this out for yourselves,from within
yourselves,not because I said so,or some book said so,but because the reality of what you are made of says so,how could it be otherwise?

I maintain that we are all the very embodiment of truth and reality,that this IS what we
are,and that the intelligent consciousness that we are totally immerced in knows this only
Too well! We have but ask ourselves the question within,and by the very nature of
universal law,corrospondence,we will recieve an echo back,we need patience though
frivolous inquiry will go nowhere,we need to be sincere in this endevour,then answers
will come.

We could quite accurately I feel be described as "Ideas informed with matter,endowed with motion and propelled through relativity by willed intent",sounds rather exciting methinks!

The great heresy upon mankind is I feel that of being seperated and apart from that which "IS".We need to understand our connectivity,our indivisibility,and our inclusivity
to all that is.

In the final analysis we all our as one,connected by a common bond of kinship to that
which IS,we all seem to have a role to play in this theatre of life,prehaps we can act out
this role together as a team,rather than some form of alone ranger looking maybe for
Tonto?

A story that I remember reading many years ago,came back into the forefront of my memory,this story concered an "angel" (spiritual being) flying over a great metropolis
with millions of inhabitants and exclaiming,"behold the city of the dead"!This caused me to puzzle many a long day as to its meaning.How could a city teeming with "life" be called by this spiritual being,a city of the dead?

Years later i think this was most likely a reference to many there not leading a spiritual
life,and that being so their inner radiance was very dim?

The potential within us is limitless,this is the message eminating from the noumena,we have but to realize this,and make it happen-to turn on our inner illuminated being and become less darkened than those before seen by the passing angel.

regards michael