PROVING Souls

[Mikal]

Hi Lesk...I like your statement, "an extension of the process of being."

I know from my own life that the soul is a "felt" experience and its connect to taking on a life in the psyche comes about through the functions of clairaudience, clairsentience and extra-sensory perception also foreknowledge.
Of course when I experienced these functions I knew nothing about them because historically we basically lost our knowledge of self or whole of self. So for me, to have this experience was to know the meaning of the mind aspects in chaos. However, chaos is simply the mind restructuring itself and the after affects are to clearly see life, the world and society in its true light. So also I think the soul functions through the aspect of higher understanding.
When I tried to write about my experience I explained the soul as a human river of emotion that flows from earth to God who receives it....
Don't ask me where that came from....smiles....deep, deep contemplation!!

Regards Mikal

[austintorn@aol.com]

"felt"

Equals sensation, for that is a part of what the mind does. There are many substrates beneath, even before getting to the level of atoms.

Imagination then takes the sensation and flies off with it to pronounce and declare meanings upon it.

[Mikal]

A “felt” experience is many times existential angst and that is because life is both expressions of the joyfully beautiful and the sorrowfully anguished. Our adaptation to the former is fully developed, our adaptation to the latter is in its infancy because we erect useless structures of thought that leave our need for depth of true intimacy with life and all expressions of life in a weak and starving state…

In the face of a tragedy delivered with all swiftness there is no time to erect useless structures of thought for our security needs….we are simply tossed into the eye of the storm!
Imagination or emotional empathy and intellectual vision are sacrificed because a tragedy cannot be changed…it is what it is! Imagination is the root of compassion and when it is sacrificed we are removed to a level of suffering not about ourselves but a moving tenderness and a living grace invisible but active in deep relationships. So it’s a penetration into the most difficult place of rawness concerning life.
With no erected thought barriers around tragedy as loss, this place of tenderness and living grace takes a paring knife to selfish needs and sculpts a model of unselfishness so the heart can have an affair with the deepest parts of life.
One is in deeply abstract places now; one has been immersed into the deepest thought and contemplation possible. Existential angst moves to evolution. At the end of deep suffering for another comes the soul….

The soul is mental/emotional quiescence united, is God in the mind, is clarity of thought, clearness of perception, is to notice, to know, to understand, is to long for, is to desire, is calm, is listening, is reflection, is peace, is degrees of concentration, is altruism and selflessness…
The soul is an attitude of adaptedness….even in the face of your provocation or agitation; I can see you from my heart which leaves my mind in stillness….

Regards Mikal

[austintorn@aol.com]

The soul is

Not 'is', but just an ungrounded theory of the invisible preached as fact, a deception, an enculturing born of the Trickster right brain that neglects the details of the left.

What you see and feel within is the brain perceiving itself through, a system built through layers of neurons, nerves, and cells, on down through molecules to atoms to electrons and further. Your imagination would have to dispense with all this and throw it out the window in order to replace its doings with something invisible, but, then again, you have stated that the brain does nothing and so these are the lengths and extremes that one must go to, ignoring what is to replace it with what isn't. Facts always trump no facts whatsoever.

You are also way off to claim provocation because a side of the discussion is contrary to your own stance. You are on ToeQuest, are you not, in a thread debating the soul?

Stress is the difference of what you expect to happen (wrongly) and what actually happens in reality. Nevertheless, detachment is a method that anyone can employ.

[AntonioLao]

that soul is a "...circle around the now."

If we all agree on the hierarchy of souls then they are concentric circles circulating the NOW and to jump from smaller circle to bigger circle would not be easier and needing the same quantum jumps between energy levels of atoms but that would imply that inner circles have higher energies that outer circles and the universe expands because the hierarchy of souls is ever increasing its circle of influence.

[Mikal]

The soul is

Not 'is', but just an ungrounded theory of the invisible preached as fact, a deception, an enculturing born of the Trickster right brain that neglects the details of the left.

What you see and feel within is the brain perceiving itself through, a system built through layers of neurons, nerves, and cells, on down through molecules to atoms to electrons and further. Your imagination would have to dispense with all this and throw it out the window in order to replace its doings with something invisible, but, then again, you have stated that the brain does nothing and so these are the lengths and extremes that one must go to, ignoring what is to replace it with what isn't. Facts always trump no facts whatsoever.

You are also way off to claim provocation because a side of the discussion is contrary to your own stance. You are on ToeQuest, are you not, in a thread debating the soul?

Stress is the difference of what you expect to happen (wrongly) and what actually happens in reality. Nevertheless, detachment is a method that anyone can employ.

The soul is not a theory; a theory is a set of ideas that attempts to explain something. The soul is in the realm of the experiential, it is to experience faculties of cognition/perception that lie deeper than the mundane surface of life. Faculties we say that are uncommon to what we know as consciousness. We are not used to these faculties so when experienced we are like a baby going from crawling to walking.

Sorry you took my comment about provocation and agitation personally and I apologize for including the word “yours” because I made you own that and become defensive. I meant to take that explanation to much broader horizons because provocation and agitation quite simply exist in life, discussions, events, circumstances and yes in people.
The soul is not just higher functions; it is a state of correct adaptability, so it is stable intelligence. The soul is that part of the mind which is analytical and solves problems related to survival whereas the lower functions are an unconscious reaction to all of life.

The soul has the capability to deeply consider pain as part of the equation of life, to acquire that wisdom is to understand all of life’s actions…..
When you transcend biology you find your soul!!

Regards Mikal

[melanie]

'' You have a mountain of concepts and words. To get rid of these, you use other concepts.
When you throw out all the concepts, including your primary concept, then whatever is, IS ''

'' The eye with which I see God
is the same as which God sees me ''

~ Meister Eckhart


Nothing can be said about SEEing ... including this lie.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salienc...euroscience%29


Only You exist, i dont.

"I dont exist" -- the outrageous ID, unknown on the web.




All there is, is THIS and IT manifests AS everything,yet IT is no-thing at all.
IT may appear as a dance, in and out of identification,
but there is no one that is identifying or dis-identifying there is only One appearing as such.

SHE is Beauty & Love.




''When we relinquish the illusion of knowledge,
as right-knowing suffuses our being throughout and displaces wrong-knowing,
then we come to reside in the loftiest dreamscape altitudes.

By transcending opposites, we awaken from the dream of many parts into the reality of the unified whole....''

~ Jed McKenna

[austintorn@aol.com]

When you transcend biology you find your soul!!

You would have to show that this theory of there being something beyond biology is not just the looking into your own brain. Until then, it is not proved and so it is just a theory—a notion. Same with extending the theory to say that it is from God. Same with then extending to say who God is and what he wants, etc.

See other posts around TQ about right/left brain functions.

[austintorn@aol.com]

9 STEPS BEYOND

1. What is seen is what Nature has wrought. To ignore what is known, such as having the brain do nothing is the first step ‘beyond’ reality. The ‘expensive’ brain uses almost half of one’s energy. Even the visual system is a part of it, as well as every nerve spindle in the body, which can also be employed for actionizing without moving.

2. Stating that there is a soul is both to ignore what is and to make up what isn’t. Now we see that’s why the brain had to go in (1). It’s that the direction of the brain would have conflicted with that of the soul. This ignoring and inventing is also accomplished when the item of (1) can’t really be minimized, such as that the ego was not meant to be used, dsying that Nature got it wrong. Both stem from the (in)vested interest in (4).

3. The soul is declared invisible, yet another step beyond. Why? See (4).

4. The soul was placed by God. Another step beyond.

5. Going even beyond, further structures are layered upon the vested interest of having God, which we all know of.

6. The God theory is held as fact, rather than a could-be, yet another step beyond, now becoming unethical—a deception, for God is just a theory. One could at least say ‘seems’.

7. The God theory is preached as truth to impressionable young minds, who, naturally, tend to believe the adults’ merciless indoctrination—a step way too far since innocents are affected.

8. The flawed concept of religious ‘good’ leads to its inverse or difference from the other flawed ‘goods’ and so is labeled as ‘evil’. The ‘goods’ must be defended, for our credibility versus theirs existing lessening our own somehow. Division. Crusades. War. A mess, not to even mention that which is versus the non-religious. These steps afar are due to the invested interest in the invisible imaginary for which no evidence is even conceivable, by definition, for the belief hangs in the air, ungrounded, its properties imagined from the sensation of looking into one’s own mind.

9. And yet, the ultimate and simple underlying basis of All, that which went onto the composite and to our complexity, was never created, having to have always been there since it could not have been created from Nothing, for Nothing cannot ‘do’, or even be ‘there’. This eternal original tiny simple ‘something’, ever there, means that there was no creation, and thus, no Creator. Complexity lies at the other end of the spectrum. We have been looking in the complete wrong direction.

[Mikal]

Austin I guess you missed my apology…sigh…had you engaged with my post through your heart you may have received it in the proper context….go figure, hidden away in life is the mystery of ….. “Search for understanding, you find wisdom… search for wisdom, you find understanding.. It’s a small and large mystery called FUSION!!

Too bad you do not exist Mel, I might have had a discussion with you but truthfully I find talking to thin air pretty fruitless.

Really we do not have to prove the soul; we need only step into our “being” (experiential) and free-flow into life as our own creative expression.

Regards Mikal