[Mr. Nobody]

"Who are we? What are we?
Where are we from? Are we here with a purpose? If so, then what is it?
Were we ment to be? Does our existence have a meaning? What does life mean??"


It appears that you have considerable difficulty about how to frame reality and how to integrate that view into your search for truth.

I am a firm believer in the Anthropic principle, not as an avoidance for answers to difficult questions, but as the final answer to it all. I believe in eternal existence without reason. A reality as opposed to a non-reality, nothing more and nothing less. We are bound to exist, otherwise there would be no one to talk about existence. A reality without existence is nonsensical and cannot exist, therefore, no beginning nor end ever happened or ever will happen. Energy cannot be created, energy just exists.

Goto http://www.toequest.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1013 for another angle of the same question

[Mr. Nobody]

It is intelligence that developed out of our ability to recognize patterns, when competition forced us to kill prey more efficiently that we discovered death and mortality. Homo Sapien watched animals die, blood on his hands and felt guilt, shame, he developed the concept of heaven, the circle of life and afterlife, resurrection, re-birth, the concept of forgiveness, fairness, good, evil and finally the concept of religion in the quest for reason. Society advanced and society took on life as the highest form of organized matter, complete with self preservation of this society and sacrifice of the individual in wars and conquest, akin to all other animal societies, most notable the insect ant colonies.
The questions of the meaning of life does not have a reality, it cannot be asked independently, because it was derived from Homo Sapiens as a tool to gain orientation within a cruel world where life depends on death.

[Marko]

Originally Posted by Mr. Nobody The questions of the meaning of life does not have a reality, it cannot be asked independently, because it was derived from Homo Sapiens as a tool to gain orientation within a cruel world where life depends on death.

I think that this question should be paraphrased to : The meaning of self awareness, or the meaning of human life. To me, the only difference between rock, germs and ape is the difference we make in our heads, because of our self awareness. We can witness that they are at different level of organization,and this is pretty much it of their existence.Without witness, they are nothing.In that manner, humans are everything - if we look things through "self awareness,consciousness,real existence".
So, until humans, "everything was nothing".

I agree that after huge number of cosmic and evolutionary accidents, there is possibility for humans to arise, without "the interference of God". Humans invented religion, and concepts like God or atheism exist only in our heads.

[michellemfry]

In Loving Memory
Date of Birth-Date of Death

Unfortunately, this is what it looks like.

[David Maes]

Originally Posted by Marko I think that this question should be paraphrased to : The meaning of self awareness, or the meaning of human life. To me, the only difference between rock, germs and ape is the difference we make in our heads, because of our self awareness. We can witness that they are at different level of organization,and this is pretty much it of their existence.Without witness, they are nothing.In that manner, humans are everything - if we look things through "self awareness,consciousness,real existence". So, until humans, "everything was nothing". I agree that after huge number of cosmic and evolutionary accidents, there is possibility for humans to arise, without "the interference of God". Humans invented religion, and concepts like God or atheism exist only in our heads.

We all live forever and for all eternity! Getting older is an illusion!

[mkirkpatrick]

Death is just another name for change,weall change,each time we die,evolution
is about learning the many lessons that life requires to fully understand who and
what we really are,and to do that we have to incarate-and reincarnate many
many times.




kind regards michael.

[Guille]

Mike, death is the opposite of change. Death is eternal, as time doesn't go by. It doesn't have events, there is no motion. Death is to stop existing, therefore to stop time in one self. Communism had death, and nothing changed in it, as it died. It chnged throghout it's life. That's one of the many examples.

[harmonygirl]

I am not sure how death can be the opposite of change, as death IS change. Just because something is dead doesn't mean there is no impact. Marx is dead, yet still having an impact, as is Einstein.

[Guille]

Originally Posted by harmonygirl I am not sure how death can be the opposite of change, as death IS change. Just because something is dead doesn't mean there is no impact. Marx is dead, yet still having an impact, as is Einstein.

I didn't refer to that. What has Marx changed after his death? The life of millions of people in the USSR, China, Cuba... Also, it is considered a cause of May 1968 in France, and one of the main influences in most philosophers of the 20th century. He lead, with his particular bible-the Communist Manifesto-, to the main theoretical discussion about the social conditioning of people. To the death of millions of people. To terible misinterpretations of his work, both from communist and capitalist, as Lenin misinterpret it complete, but so did the 'defenders' of a capitalist world. He lead to a main fear in the life of people, who discussed whether the capitalism or communism woudl win. And many, many other things. But there is something I notice. None of these changes that were caused by Marx, were affected on Marx. That is, once Marx had died, he didn't have change in his lif,e he didn't divorce, or have children, he didn't buy a new car, he didn't move. He had ceased to exist as himself. He, Marx, was simply his books, the momories of him, and the photos of him. What I meant in my post was that death is the opposite of change becuase after death there is nothing that happens. Marx's death lead to change in the world. But what I was meaning wasn't about something affecting another thing, not even something of a smaler digree affecting something of a bigger one. What I meant was that things cease to affect themselves, nor do external things affect it. Marx died, and he didn't change his existence from then on, nor did I change his, nor did anyone. The same with Einstein. The same with the world, if it dies, if ceases to exist, then I won't be able to change it (which is my intention), nor could all of the world change anything of itself, nor could another civilisation change the world. End minds END, nothing more.

[harmonygirl]

Your definition of change is a lot more narrow than mine. I was talking of death as not being the death of the impact of the person, but that's not the topic of this thead. Marx's death meant he didn't change in this dimension (that we can see). If all we are is biology, then yes, nothing happens after we die. I don't ascribe to this view. Marx, etc. were more than just their biologies.