Realism and the Existence of Nothing

[Guille]

I believe that we must clarify in this thread what is the actual existence of nothing, nothingness, 0, empty set, absolute vacuum...This means, to determine the what kind of existence if any at all do the representations and concepts of Absense have.

In this theme, we must all agree that these exist as concepts and symbols. This means, that they are part of our thoughts and part of our expressions of our thoughts. To extend this, we can say that nothingness exists in the mind.

But the question now is: Is nothing "real"? Does it have an existence out of the mind?

You may have noticed that I havne't used the word "physical". This is because the fact of existing out of the mind, and being real, doesn't impply a physical existence. It is a concept hard to think about, but evne harder to express. Basically, if the is "nothing" out of the universe, what is it? It's extremelly hard to idealize, and impossible to visualize by imagination.

I very welcome any person who wants to share some thoughts in this.

[mkirkpatrick]

Guille,thought that I would add to your question,I hope that you dont think that
I am Poco Loco,the whole question of No-thing is that it cannot and has never
been any part of reality,it very name is an insult to the itelligence from whence we came,the universe is absolutely full to the brim,sofull in fact that you could
not squeeze a 20 uro note in between.man in his infinite folly thinks up absurd
ideas,then spends the next 50 years trying to answer them,any kid on the block
with half a brain can tell you that you cant get something from no-thing.

the word is really a question in two parts.no-to deny,thing an object.now an object is real,no problem.and no,well that has been said to me many times?

We have to look through the fog andthe illusion and find some light to guide us
out of the miasma thatwe have created.

kind regards, michael.

[Graybeard]

As I was going up the stair
I met a Man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish to God he'd go away

ANON

[Graybeard]

for some reason i accidently submitted this twice .... ooops

[Graybeard]

Guille .... Michael

I believe that we must clarify in this thread what is the actual existence of nothing, nothingness, 0, empty set, absolute vacuum...This means, to determine the what kind of existence if any at all do the representations and concepts of Absense have.

In this theme, we must all agree that these exist as concepts and symbols. This means, that they are part of our thoughts and part of our expressions of our thoughts. To extend this, we can say that nothingness exists in the mind.

I have done a lot of SQL Programming and Database Operation and maintenance. The hardest thing for SQL to deal with is NULL.
When is Nothing really Nothing. i have a book by Chris Date ... the Father of Database ... that has a whole Chapter on 'Nothing'

Your thread made me think deeply about this ... to little avail. For what its worth.... as follows

After many years of puzzling over the difference between us, mankind, and all other species .... i finally arrived at just one difference...

Not that we have a soul .... (i used to think that)
Not that we are smarter.... (this is not a difference)
Not that we are better at Everything .... no need for a remark here

In all species ... What you see .. is what you get ... but for all species, except Man .... what you don't see, you never will.
ie: if i am a monkey and all us monkeys are sitting round chewing bananas, and i wander off for a leak, and while i am away a Tiger descends on the group and carries of 'Bob' or 'Alice'..... when i get back will i find that out ... i may notice that everyone is upset and stressed ... i may even notice that 'Bob' or 'Alice' is missing ... but i will never know s/he was carried off by a Tiger.. and i will never ever know...even if 'Alice' was my wife..... strange

Other species don't have News... its as simple as that .... i am not saying this is the 'why' .. i am just saying this is the 'reason'

That means we must have achieved everything today, technology, philosphy, the Internet..... everything ...because we can gossip...

We can 'see' things in our minds 'eye' as clearly as though we were there...
This is a very clever (and vital) trick for any species ...and it can be used for other purposes.. it can allow us to see things that never happened ... this allows our imagination to roam...

if we are short of a construct that doesn't exist ... but really ... it would be handy ... then make one in your minds eye .... i think this is what 'NOTHING' is ...

Nothing is a construct
.....that the gossiping species required
..........in order to contrast and communicate
...............certain attributes and events
....................when there was no one there to see!

Just my thoughts ... GREG

[Guille]

Nothing is the absense, the non being, thus, it is non-existence. But does non-existence, exist? Well, this is a very hard thing to discuss. I hope my following paragraph helps:


Non-existence exists for non-existence, this is, it non-exists (in the sense of existing in the existence of non-existence). Non-existence also exists to the whole of reality, which is thes et of all existences, including, of course, existence and non-existence. But non-existenc eexists in reality only in the non-existence existence, that is, it exists in reality non-existentially existing. And, finally, non-existence exists to existence in the sense that it is it's opposite, i.e. in the sense that it is what doesn't exist in itself. This is, non-existence exists in existence as the non-existence of existence itself.

The above parahraph is philosphically hypoercomplex, but when one has the idea in the mind, one understands it. I recomend to read my signature now. Because, I am a thinker, and I can think many things, but I am not an artist, thus, I cannot express my thoughts as good as I would like to.

[BIG-BERTA]

I think there can not be anything without first being nothing and i believe that we can consider

SPACE as NOTHING

MATTER as a THING


I really like this thread

[Guille]

Big Berta,

What background makes you think space is nothing?

What about time?

[BIG-BERTA]

What really interests me is why TIME should be present in this thread, because i see no reason of it

I think Time has to do with a Matter

[Guille]

What really interests me is why TIME should be present in this thread, because i see no reason of it

I think Time has to do with a Matter

Well, I have mentioned time because out of those who believe that nothing exists, are those who believe that space or time is nothing. You believe space is nothing, but, if you realise, time should be nearer to being notihng for it is not an entity, it is just a property of entities, in this case of matter.