Preserving Strong Belief

[austintorn@aol.com]

Preserving Strong Belief

There are various defense mechanisms employed by those with deep and strongly held beliefs to preserve them against any kind of breach. These beliefs range from spirit realms to UFO abductions to various other supposed superstitions and invisible happenings, and can become severe addictions.

Those so addicted will go against all common sense and even science, sometimes resorting to huffiness and even name calling and/or anger, or at least simple preaching, over and over.

I was told once that demons were responsible for my resistance. Now that is a good one since it even employs the spiritual addiction that I was resisting.

In the case of evolution, which demonstrates that creatures have been fine-tuned to the Earth and the universe rather than any other way around, such as God fine tuning the universe for us, or at least one tiny part, I am told that evolution was a put up, its discovery planned by social engineers who wished to undermine the word of the Bible; yet, evolution showed true, so I’m not sure what this argument really does. Then I was told that the Bible was not truly written in plain text for the common man, but requires expert symbolists for its interpretation, which of course rewrites the Bible to better match reality. Another said that evolution is simply not true, refusing to entertain any study of it.

Other methods amount to merely repeating the claims as truth and fact, even when they are shown to be suppositions. This is denial and neglect.

Astrology and numerology yet persist, people arranging it to come out applicable in very general terms that can’t miss some kind of mark that ever applies to all.

Some believers truly live in a fantasy world, ever wanting what ought to be. This is even applied to people, too, saying what they should do, could do, and ought to do; yet, wisdom, apparently lacking in strong believers, is not there to take note that people can’t, won’t, and don’t.

The solution, employing our own wisdom, is to bypass any negotiation with these people upon confirmation of their inability, rather than trying to reach them any longer. Nationally, the separation of church and state is one way, and of course if they are out to cause harm to others in order to protect their beliefs, then arrest or warring back, such as against religious terror or war is in order, the only chance for not learning the easy way being the hard way.

For the peaceful types it is live and let live.

[labelwench]

For the peaceful types it is live and let live.

Originally posted by Austintorn

Live and let live is actually a very strong 'belief system' in it's own right, and is a central tenet shared by a number of religious and non-religious factions. Not all 'belief systems' practice strong conversion tactics.

Some of them, one is expected to find by their own efforts.

[austintorn@aol.com]

A wise man from Australia once said, “Why try to convince them [the strong believers]; they won’t change; so don’t bother.”

This is absolutely true and that’s what this thread is about. It’s a meta-discussion about discussions that can’t work. It’s not likely than any more than a few strong believers will be able to incorporate any contrary information. It’s like asking one to disbelieve their own thoughts, a tough thing, this made even tougher against very heavy swells of oncoming tidal waves of those thoughts. One might still post against but only for the readership by a larger audience.

For real things, such as in science, there can always be real discussion. For invisible things there can only be pronouncements and declarations, and those being rehashed.

A site that has science roots but turns to non-science magical realm areas will not really do much in the way of true conclusions or discussion in those areas, although it may still look like there is discussion, as well as conclusions that just end up matching the premise by the placing of an equal sign in between.

What is the science of the nature of a very strong belief and how and why does it take such as hold so as to be immune from change?

[labelwench]

What is the science of the nature of a very strong belief and how and why does it take such as hold so as to be immune from change?
Originally posted by Austintorn.

The 'science' of the nature of a very strong belief system has a great deal to do with a mechanism for population control, the 'politics' of religion, both topics that are not to be discussed on this forum.

The benefits of being aligned with a particular 'belief system' carry other benefits to the individuals and as a herd species, most seek a sense of community, which may not be shared by our biological family.

It is belief systems against belief systems for the control of population, geography and resources. Even science must bow to capitalism and the politically correct if it wishes to be funded.

The very conflict between science and religion is likely promoted by capitalism, for by keeping all parties divided, it is ever easier to control the masses.

Just my opinion.....

[Graybeard]

A wise man from Australia once said, “Why try to convince them [the strong believers]; they won’t change; so don’t bother.”

Not me ?? I'm not wise ... what I said was that if they won't listen when your polite, do you think they will listen when your impolite.

cool bananas ... greg

[austintorn@aol.com]

Not me ?? I'm not wise ... what I said was that if they won't listen when your polite, do you think they will listen when your impolite.

cool bananas ... greg

That's cool, for either way there is no listening possible, which I observe on other forums, too. What a great time saver it is to ignore the repeated declarations that can't give rise to any real discussions on a discussion forum. Thanks to the Australian guy for this observation.

[austintorn@aol.com]

Live and let live is actually a very strong 'belief system' in it's own right, and is a central tenet shared by a number of religious and non-religious factions. Not all 'belief systems' practice strong conversion tactics.

Some of them, one is expected to find by their own efforts.

Live and let live deals with the actual reality of situations among real people in a real realm, and so it can be known beyond just a belief.

[austintorn@aol.com]

We see the evidence on forums of the insistence of invisibles as truth and fact with a total resistance to changing that stance.

The recommendation is to largely ignore strong beliefs asserting invisibles, as only an unproductive discussion can follow. Perhaps engage once in a while for the benefit of others reading who are no yet so inclined toward the intractability of strong belief with no substance to show for it.

We allow that the belief may be comforting and useful, but the ontological claims must ever fall flat, as outright declarations.

[austintorn@aol.com]

Scientific evidence isn't 100% reliable, but there are degrees of reliability that show, many of them high. This is quite different than having faith in something, which by definition is 100% certainty upon 0% showing.