[RascalPuff]

How can the sufferings of one Holy man, wash away the sins of mankind?
I have never understood this but certainly would like to be edified on this note.

Regards,
- RP

[austintorn@aol.com]

One holy man can’t wash away sins, but it was an idea that caught on. Not well known is that there were many saviour myths and realizations of these, now forgotten, but in the end just human wishes that came into being from their possibility, such as the sun god, moon god, etc.

The paradox is that, of all things, sins should not be washed away then or now (by act of contrition) as it enables the sinning. On the other hand, if sinning is a natural part of man’s nature and unavoidable, then there should be no consequences to wash away in the first place.

Neither the Jewish nor the Romans there at the time were impressed by miracles, so I have to assume that there weren’t any—just tales that grew like those of King Arthur, who was, by the way, seven generations descended from the saviour.

Even now, new myths form—the saviour spent his early days in America, so they say.

Of course he still had influence, like Ghandi and the like, as all good people do.

Better to be good for nothing (ha-ha), but you know that I mean, good for good’s sake, not because somebody might be watching.

[mkirkpatrick]

Good question Rascal,the answer is he cannot this is a fantasy invented by those who
want their cake and eat it,and also to own the bakery?

We are all personally responsible for all we do,and are held to account by the grand law of karma.We repay all our dues debts and fees,down to the last penny,no one can or will ever do that for us,it is against universal law,and karma is a universal law.



regards michael.

[Graybeard]

I once knew a Holy Man. His name was Nasrudin, others might know him as Nasrettin, or even Hoja. One day he was wandering in a cemetary when he stumbled and fell into an old grave.

Laying there in the cool of the earth, he began to visualise what it would be like to be dead. How would it feel. For a short while he dozed. He was awoken by a noise.

It flashed into his mind that the good and bad recording Angels of Reckoning, Munkir and Nakir, were coming for him. But it was really only a Camel Caravan passing by. In a terrible panic, he scaled the sides of the grave, ran towards the perimeter and tripped over the fence, right in front of the Caravan.

The frightened Camels stampeded and the angry Camelteers rushed upon him and thrashed him with sticks. He fled home in a distressed state.

His wife asked him what was the matter and why was he late.

"I have been dead", said Nasrudin

Interested for once, despite the many years she had been married to him, she asked,

"What was it like?"

"Not to bad at all", Nasrudin replied, "unless you upset the Camels, then they beat you with sticks"



LOL ... greg

[Profpat]

I think that myth came from Paul. No wonder how he was able to convert so many gentiles. However I do believe in personal forgiveness.

Pat

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by Profpat I think that myth came from Paul. No wonder how he was able to convert so many gentiles. However I do believe in personal forgiveness. Pat

Many thanks Pat.I agree on that one!


reegards michael.

[cosvis]

A good question; but what does it mean? If sin is a violation against the law of the creator, a Trinity of divine persons, than He alone can pardon and wash away its guilt. If it is his will to become a man than the sufferring of that Holy man would be able to wash away the sins of mankind.

[Profpat]

Hi Cosvis;

Welcome to the group. I see from your profile that you did missionary work. Was that in Australia?

I am a theist and so I agree that God can pretty much do what God wants to do.

The Buddhist have a saying that: " If you see the Buddha in the streets; kill him."( Food for thought )

Best to you,

Pat

[cosvis]

Hi Pat,

To your question, I must tell you that I enjoyed twenty years of meaningful and enriching experiences overseas. It was not easy because of different customs, languages, and climate, but very precious and rewarding.

I find the idea of killing the Buddha in the street rather puzzeling? I would love to meet a thoughtful person who might be able to impart some wisdom. But I must confess, I have little understanding of Buddhism.

Dear Pat, if you are a theist and believe that God is the creator of everything, Do you believe that "God is love"? Where does our ability to love, or in other words, our natural ability to be personal come from? If we have received it from God, our creator, must God not than himself be personal?

[Profpat]

Hi Cosvis;

I do indeed believe in God's personal love. In fact I experience it on a daily basis, as I'm sure you do also.

My Idea of the theory of everything, includes God,
and touches upon love, family etc. It ends with a picture of my good looking grandson. You can access it at:
(http://www.toequest.com/forum/yourto...2803-idea.html )
You'll have to access it through the PDF file.
I hope you have a chance to view it. Being a new member you may not be able to access the PDF file for a few days.
I would love to hear your comments.

Do you have a theory Cosvis? If so I'm sure we all would enjoy seeing it, I know I would.

For the Buddha: He's not suppose to be outside of you but inside of you. Therefore, if you see the Buddha on the street, kill him.

Best to you,

Pat