You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.
Has this been discussed? It's in the topic description and I was just wondering, before I read the topic description, what the point of the toe is. How will a toe change anything? Will everyone even believe it with proof that it is the toe? I don't see it affecting life much, I don't think change in humanity will accompany a toe. So if it can't change much of anything, what is the point? Understanding the how and whys of everything won't make us happier or nicer people, it will just give us a couple ah ha's and that's probably about it. Is it really worth all the thought and effort that has gone into it? It's probably going to only be 20 seconds long and people have been pondering it for thousands of years.
I'd say that there are two types of people around. Those who live each day of their life taking for granted that they are here and thus earning money, building relationships, etc.. and those of us who are intrigued by the fact that we are here, and furthermore intrigued by the way our universe works. Of course, the latter being can also have traits that belong to the former group. I would put myself in the latter group, as I imagine most people here would.
Now, is there any real point to trying to describe nature? Well, some people, namely those in the first group, would say no, of course not: we're here so we might as well make the most of it. But, there are people who say yes, we want to know as much as possible about the world in which we live. This is what the theory of everything hopes to achieve, and many people dedicate their lives to answering such questions. Will it benefit human nature? Probably not, but it would sure be interesting to those of use who are intrigued about the universe in which we live. Is it worth the thought and effort? Well, it depends how you measure "worth." If you measure it by money then, no. But if you measure it by something else, then a theory of everything will make many people content. I, for one, would be extremely content, and fascinated by a theory of everything.
To conclude, and answer the question, I don't think a TOE is "needed," but I would say that it is wanted by many people.
~neutralino
If you haven't found something strange during the day, it hasn't been much of a day - John A. Wheeler.
Copernicus suggested that the planets move around the Sun. If he hadn't, we would still live our lives according to religious ritual.
Galileo proved that Copernicus was right, for which fact he was arrested by the Catholic Inquisition. Galileo's discovery enabled Newton to formulate the Laws of Gravity, which enabled us to build according to engineering principles. This led to the Industrial revolution.
Otherwise we would still be an agricultural society, suffer from smallpox, die from the plague, live the lives of Serfs, our lives forfeit to our wealthy spiritual masters. We would never have discovered that the plague was carried by fleas.
Isn't it better to be free at whatever the cost of todays problems. Science is the only tool that can solve our current and future problems.
We (life) cannot live on this Planet forever, the carbon cycle that supports life is winding down as the Earth cools, apart from our own intervention, volcanic activity has lessened (lengthening the carbon cycle) the Sun will run out of fuel .... we can only solve short term problems at the moment, problems that put off the day of Earth's reckoning. Admittedly we cause other problems at the same time, but Science, while finding short term answers is looking for long term answers in the TOE.
Long term we have to think of Life's future, not our personal short term goals. The TOE will enable us to solve Life's long term obstacles. If you think Science has not done much for society, its removal would bring instant disaster as we tried to cope with the health and welfare of billions, and only a horse drawn plough to do it with.
Never underestimate the value of a known fact, even if you don't understand its implications yet.
Science enables hope, eg: with Science we may survive, or we may not! But without Science we're doomed. Some people might say that Science has caused the problems, but we have to learn, mistakes will always be made, there is no other way. You don't refuse medicine when you are sick, whatever your long term beliefs.
Sally, Neutralino ... I ashamed of you both for not knowing this ??? ..... (just joking )
cool bananas ... greg
'Blondie says I must hate all Brunettes. I'll try, but if I can't ... I'll love them both' ... graffiti on Tavern wall, Pompeii, circa AD 70.
Ok, I understand it better now Greg but you brought up a good point, you called it a fact. Theory isn't fact is it? Why isn't it called the 'fact of everything' instead of the 'theory of everything'? FOE vs TOE?
Another thing, shouldn't this fact of everything be more than just words and numbers? Isn't there something missing in trying to understand everything? Like I have said before, it needs to be more of a demo somehow, a show instead of a tell. Think about it, people have been pondering and writing about it for thousands of years and nobody has proved anything, so I guess that proves my point that it will have to be something other than writing. And that's where science and technology come in, technology will show it better than any words. I don't think it can be explained, I don't think words can describe it, wouldn't it be much more than that? It has to be beyond comprehension of words since so far we haven't found the right words and I am sure billions of combinations have been attempted.
The rewards of the objective will likely redeem the quest.
When the telephone was first invented, the polled public was ambivalent about its practical applications, since the communications advantages were not apparent due to lack of experience with that now miraculously advantageous medium.
(George Berkeley, 1710) ... lay the beginning in a distinct explication of what is meant by thing, reality, existence: for in vain shall we dispute concerning the real existence of things, or pretend to any knowledge thereof, so long as we have not fixed the meaning of those words.
"All things come out of the one and the one out of all things." - Heraclitus "Reality is an illusion - albeit a persistent one." - Einstein "Particles give me a headache." - Ibid
Ok, I understand it better now Greg but you brought up a good point, you called it a fact. Theory isn't fact is it? Why isn't it called the 'fact of everything' instead of the 'theory of everything'? FOE vs TOE?
Because science doesn't allow one to prove anything; only disprove it. For a scientific theory to be widely accepted as true, it must account for all the observational data, and agree with it all. However, there is nothing to say that one day we might find some piece of observational data which disagrees with the theory. The theory becomes stronger and stronger the more data it accounts for, but is never absolute truth: i.e. this is not mathematics!
~neutralino
If you haven't found something strange during the day, it hasn't been much of a day - John A. Wheeler.
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to neutralino For This Useful Post:
= is the single absolute truth of any equation, everything else is only probable at best. And Oh Ya, have I ever mentioned the simple little truth that = is synonymous with the unity of everthing. Which then truly makes = TOE.. So now you know and there you go, It's time to be truly one!
= is the single absolute truth of any equation, everything else is only probable at best. And Oh Ya, have I ever mentioned the simple little truth that = is synonymous with the unity of everthing. Which then truly makes = TOE.. So now you know and there you go, It's time to be truly one!
= MJA
Well said MJA,you are a poet and din't even know it!
regards michael.
Humilty,coupled with boldness,surprises truth to
reveal herself?
The Following User Says Thank You to mkirkpatrick For This Useful Post:
)
Re: Why is the toe needed? -
01-15-2008, 11:45 AM
Linear Mode
