[mkirkpatrick]

Consciousness holds the key to the R.O.E.Reality of Everything,rather than just the theory
of everything,after all reality is hardly a theory is it?Consciousness is real,that which IS,is
real,we then are aware of our consciousness,self-awareness,we know that we know,it is this understanding that leads us to the conclusion that consciousness is the primal actioner
of all manifested existence and masks as all the other ("THINGS").




regards michael.

[mkirkpatrick]

Consciousness and awareness of its primal potentcy is gathering momentum,soon it will
run like a stream,then quickly become a torrent as more acceptence of its rightful place
in the "scheme of things" is reported from the science fraternity.




regards michael.

[Graybeard]

Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick We know that we know, it is this understanding that leads us to the conclusion that consciousness is the primal actioner of all manifested existence

There is no valid deduction from the phrase 'We know that we know' that leads to the conclusion that consciousness (Sapience) is the 'primal actioner'

Presumably 'Primal Actioner' equates to first cause. If Sapience is the result of complex biological functions .... then they (biological actions) would be the 'Primal Actioner'.

But we class them as organic ! Organic compounds are made from inorganic elements ... So now they become the 'Primal Actioner' . How far do we go .... and why did you only use your 'reductio absurdium' until you arrived at Consciousness ?

Was this as far as you could go before you 'hit the wall' of your own superstitions ?

Get with it Michael, your logic of first causes is faulty this time anyway.

Cool bananas ... greg

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by Graybeard There is no valid deduction from the phrase 'We know that we know' that leads to the conclusion that consciousness (Sapience) is the 'primal actioner' Presumably 'Primal Actioner' equates to first cause. If Sapience is the result of complex biological functions .... then they (biological actions) would be the 'Primal Actioner'. But we class them as organic ! Organic compounds are made from inorganic elements ... So now they become the 'Primal Actioner' . How far do we go .... and why did you only use your 'reductio absurdium' until you arrived at Consciousness ? Was this as far as you could go before you 'hit the wall' of your own superstitions ? Get with it Michael, your logic of first causes is faulty this time anyway. Cool bananas ... greg

Apart from not walking under ladders,I am not that superstitious,thanks for your comments mate,you say my logic is faulty,is it really?The "primal actioner"is really
the Will,however Greg,as this threads theme is consciousness,and as consciousness arises
from the will I considered it apropriate to use here.

We live and move and have our being within the will of Absolute-INtent,we are all within the mind of the ONE,the difficulties "stack up" when you begin to realise that we are all
illusions Greg,ones ego fights to remain "individual" and to retain a personality!

Consciousness arises from within Absolute-Mind-as does ALL-ELSE,there is no outside,just
within.Whether it be inorganic-or organic Greg matters not one jot,for all is alive within this universe,there is but LIFE,death is what we ignorant souls call life beyond our KEN!

regards michael.

[arthur]

Originally Posted by G_burnett hi art, you did a lot of reading, more then i have. Its the end of your quote that caught my thoughts, very interesting. Perception, limited, .... mind sets, obedience to authority, impure human consciousness, rationalizations, hopes and dreams, and many more things that curtail the understanding? We do know in physics that the wave form of perception is also transmittable by the mind to others perception transcending quantified space and conceptions of time... do you seek ways of practice? Or do you seek understanding of the event without acceptance? maybe like the Tarot deck it will find you when you are ready and there is no other way, but thus a personal way, alone, sometimes never found, never given. Peace~ Graham

Quote:

Originally Posted by arthur
(from Wadebridge)
I cannot see how 'conventional understanding' of a link between the forces alone can result in something called a Theory of *Everything* even though 'they' may be things in their own right.

Michael, I see in other threads and forums and else where that your self and a few others are touching on the idea that there is perhaps an underlying principle which might link everything together, the details of what this actually means to yourself and to the others I cant imagine. Why do you think that after a few millennia of thinking and writing and talking the principle, if there is one is not general knowledge?

arthur
hi art, you did a lot of reading, more then i have. Its the end of your quote that caught my thoughts, very interesting.

Perception, limited, .... mind sets, obedience to authority, impure human consciousness, rationalizations, hopes and dreams, and many more things that curtail the understanding?

is also transmittable by the mind to others perception transcending quantified space and conceptions of time... do you seek ways of practice? Or do you seek understanding of the event without acceptance?

maybe like the Tarot deck it will find you when you are ready and there is no other way, but thus a personal way, alone, sometimes never found, never given.


Hello Graham.
I guess there is a certain pleasure in knowing that some one has read and maybe understood, at least, some of what one puts out on a public forum.
I am not sure what you meant by me having done a lot of reading and I don't understand the para' "We do know in physics that the wave form of perception etc"

Your reasons for the link between everything, if there is one, not being general knowledge, on the face of it, seem plausable, but, I suggest, the obviouse reason for a phrase,a sentence or a formula which if understood would give reason for everything being what it is has not over the hundreds of years been constructed, particularly in the world of "science", is due to intellectual bigotry-and- in the world of real people, although they do understand the essence of what the phrase or sentence represents they have never had a need or the skill to intellectualize it. Rather like the gibbons or the illiterate trapeeze artists who do understand a great deal about gravity.
My original letter was just an attempt to elicite ideas about (1) is a T.O.E literally everything and if it is, (2) to find out how people might direct their efforts to finding a direction for a search for it.

Graham, my problem is that I do have a phrase and a sentence which, if understood, gives reason why every and anything is what it is but because of the potential distructive nature of understanding it I am not sure how or if I should present it.

regards...arthur

[mkirkpatrick]

Thanks for your thoughtful comments Arthur,there is most certainly an underlying principle that links all to its core,that is the the principle of LOVE,better understood as
absolute-inclusivity and atoneness with the INtenion of the Will-to-form,and in-form intent?

This principle has been known about and accepted by millions for many centuries,it is that
the west confuses this universal principle and muddles the divinty of love-will-intent to form with religion and man made superstitions.



regards michael.

[mkirkpatrick]

Mindfulness that which is from the mind-is there anything in this universe that is not of mindful substance? My answer is a firm NO!All is indeed mind,and we are within the mind of the Absolute-think about it,with your mind of course!




regards michael.

[G_burnett]

Originally Posted by arthur Quote: Originally Posted by arthur (from Wadebridge) Hello Graham. I guess there is a certain pleasure in knowing that some one has read and maybe understood, at least, some of what one puts out on a public forum. I am not sure what you meant by me having done a lot of reading and I don't understand the para' "We do know in physics that the wave form of perception etc" Your reasons for the link between everything, if there is one, not being general knowledge, on the face of it, seem plausable, but, I suggest, the obviouse reason for a phrase,a sentence or a formula which if understood would give reason for everything being what it is has not over the hundreds of years been constructed, particularly in the world of "science", is due to intellectual bigotry-and- in the world of real people, although they do understand the essence of what the phrase or sentence represents they have never had a need or the skill to intellectualize it. Rather like the gibbons or the illiterate trapeeze artists who do understand a great deal about gravity. My original letter was just an attempt to elicite ideas about (1) is a T.O.E literally everything and if it is, (2) to find out how people might direct their efforts to finding a direction for a search for it. Graham, my problem is that I do have a phrase and a sentence which, if understood, gives reason why every and anything is what it is but because of the potential distructive nature of understanding it I am not sure how or if I should present it. regards...arthur

Hi arthur
The TOE site here gives rise to many perceptive conceptions. The platforms of perception are varied and come from education, culture, personally acceptable input, rote, theology, nature, ... on an on we can go.

What picture can we paint that all picture thinkers will see the same thing? What words can we give to the word thinkers that will mean the same thing to them? What sharing depiction will we give to the aggressive that they will not try to pee on the wall higher or aggressive rule to the sharers such that they will not toss out just because it came to them in an agressive manner?

Ethics my friend are the root of rule of law ... I have recently subscribed to a world wide organization that collects data .... everything. They have been doing it for a long time with the belief that some are worthy to access it and some maybe are not .. blue book stuff sort of thing but oh its a lot more then that.

The circle is there and there are those here in it even if they do not know it!

strange ... the idea of not sharing seems at first so, can we say stupid and UN what? UN equal? I personally would not give a loaded shotgun to a kid knowing he could pull the trigger, nor would i give the same to another older person so i am ethical without inequality a factor. If I wanted information I would ask and be given a query why? If I could give the right reason I could have it ... does it make sense? I do not know more then how it does to me because if I was denied the information asked for I would have to go through a learning process, convincing the holders those in the circle the query was not for the bad ...and this is legit form of being a keeper, a holder ... in the next five years 45 million people will be dead from AIDS but how many have been told that be for they die the average resulting deaths will be eleven times for each infected before they die? or that the mutations of the virus will see it airborne in less then six years? If this is real or not is up to each of interest to look at but maybe not to a posted conclusion ... can we go there? can we do the post?
I could not knowing the trigger could be pulled or would be but presentation is what its all about sometimes and those in the circle can conclude those out will not and that is why it is strange thus we speak of.

the para was test query TY. Platforms of others are very important to me and I gather despite not in spite because of this platform variance, and I like intelligence, I like it seething and breaking out in a scream from the masses of wrens and sparrows flirting around ... the primal yell manifested and who else can hear but another ?

Even stranger me thinks these mind sets found and definitely worth presence. This is my exploration realm.

So all in all said my hopefully new friend take a look around! There are a lot of very serious thinkers in here and I for one though sometimes failing to express it will look forward to your posts how ever formatted.

Peace~! graham

[G_burnett]

Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick Mindfulness that which is from the mind-is there anything in this universe that is not of mindful substance? My answer is a firm NO!All is indeed mind,and we are within the mind of the Absolute-think about it,with your mind of course! regards michael.

Hi my friend ... heres food for thought?

Ashtavakra Samhita as it is sometimes called, is a very ancient Sanskrit text.

first they were stories told by tribal holders of knowledge and long before written language so the translation is difficult for me to give the full meaning of some of it myself.

Ashtavakra said:

Rare indeed, my son, is the lucky man whose observation of the world’s behavior has led to the extinction of his thirst for living, thirst for pleasure, and thirst for knowledge.

Is he not a guru who, endowed with dispassion and equanimity, achieves full knowledge of the nature of consciousness, and leads others out of samsara?

If you would just see the transformations of the elements as nothing more than the elements, then you would immediately be freed from all bonds and established in your own nature.

One’s desires are samsara.

unquote text

Peace! ~ Graham

[melanie]

Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick Mindfulness that which is from the mind-is there anything in this universe that is not of mindful substance? My answer is a firm NO! All is indeed mind,and we are within the mind of the Absolute-think about it,with your mind of course! regards michael.

I'm going to use my mind now to say ..
The Absolute mind is perfect clarity, our mind is only an interpretation,
sometimes it becomes cloudy and distorted, we are the reflection of the pristine mirror.
We are the ripples. the dust on the perfect still surface.
If we allow ourself to be still however to be mindful, becoming aware of the inner stillness, the silent depth beneath the stormy ocean above.
We become the channel for perfect truth to flow.

Unavoidably we become an entanglement of sorts.
Like the many assortment of waves rising and falling on the surface of the ocean.
When we don't listen to the silent inner voice.
The voice of the absolute.
We are tossed about like the waves.

We live on borrowed thoughts, either from our own memory the illusionary past or from the thoughts of others, also illusionary.
We don't live in the now.
That is why we get entangled up in conceptual junk.

Thoughts are invisible, they are all stored in a realm known as a thought sphere, or the collective consciousness.

The physicalness of ourself is the visible,
and our consciousness is our invisible self.
So what ever the collective psyche has thought, so it will become.

The invisible self ''consciousness'' is latent, until it makes contact,
This is known as knowledge on demand, making contact as knowing sensation, out of which the visible self arises.

The truth of who and what we are resides in the stillness of the now.
There can only ever be ONE truth.
Everything else is a bad interpretation.
Even the now is an illusion, because it is never constant.
you can never step into the same river twice.

I think all of this imagery we see is thought into existence.
When we are not thinking... nothing exists. Like when we are in deep sleep.
Thought appears as one big superimposed picture all at once,
layers and layers of thoughts stacked up like a pile of post-it's

Truth can never exist outside of the now.For that doesn't exist.
Projecting or re-calling thought is an interpretation of the now.
That is a second hand truth, but not the actual truth.

The truth is in the immediacy of this only existing now moment.
One without a second.
All else is an interpretation of something that has already passed away and dissolved.

Sorry about this non-sense, but it is my non-sense and my non-sense makes sense to me.
And it's all very grand. Indeed.

LOL

melanie.