[Mr. Snyde]

Ah yes, science. The most rigid belief system of them all. Cleverly disguised as a methodology for discovering 'truth'.

[Mr. Snyde]

Originally Posted by dleviwing Michael; Though universe consciousness is an appealing concept and one I've pondered in the past, I remain steadfast to the scientific methodology of measurement in order to qualify it as known. Until then, we can only create a philosophy or belief of this concept. If we allow belief systems to be included in science, then science becomes just another religion. We are too close to that scenario now with Relativity, QM, and M-theory. I can only support you if you can demonstrate a method to measure it.

Mr. Snyde understands the need to measure and define things in order to establish a concensus reality. The scientific method has done a great job of mapping out the universe with its numbers and symbols.
However Mr. Snyde tends to think that nothing can ever be truly defined. Everything is subject to further definition as long as there is a creative mind applying the energy to do so.
A question may be answered, but when that answer is examined, it is not difficult to ask three or more questions pertaining to it. Following this logic, one begins to see how measurement is only useful if at some point we collectively agree to stop measuring. This, however goes against the very nature of exploration and the principles of science. So we have a quandry.
Does this mean then that a Theory of Everything is impossible to define? Not if the definition encompasses this fundamental principle of the universe. Everything defined is subject to further definition.

[austintorn@aol.com]

The simple THREE of matter in motion through space pervades the universe and led to complex consciousness. The manufacture of the THREE is just the first step of the process. From hereon out, it's just the THREE and the composites made from them over 13.75 billion years.

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com The simple THREE of matter in motion through space pervades the universe and led to complex consciousness. The manufacture of the THREE is just the first step of the process. From hereon out, it's just the THREE and the composites made from them over 13.75 billion years.

An interesting notion indeed Austin,but suppose,that the reverse were true,out of consciousness came the three?




regards michael.

[mkirkpatrick]

Thanks for showing interest in this modest little thread Mr Snyde,btw,is that your real name?You mention defining things,and further defining,until ones runs out of definitions
I suppose!Prehaps when all "things" are seen as one thing,the job will become much more
simplfied?



regards michael.

[austintorn@aol.com]

If the THREE were made out of consciousness, they would just be projections and couldn't interact like the real stuff that eventually amounts to our own consciousness.

Whatever made the THREE is only to guess at—and no one would really just want to randomly declare this unknowable unseeable state as anything to live life by or to make up arbitrary hopes for returning to, etc., would they? (I think I have just defined superstition.)

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by austintorn@aol.com If the THREE were made out of consciousness, they would just be projections and couldn't interact like the real stuff that eventually amounts to our own consciousness. Whatever made the THREE is only to guess at—and no one would really just want to randomly declare this unknowable unseeable state as anything to live life by or to make up arbitrary hopes for returning to, etc., would they? (I think I have just defined superstition.)

That may well prove to be the case Austin,well done that man!




regards michael.

[mkirkpatrick]

Consciousness and expansion go hand in hand,as we grow in understanding and gain
further insight and realizaion,so too does our consciousness expand into this freed up space?We are only limited by our ability to comprehend further insights.



regards michael.

[Sentient marine]

Originally Posted by mkirkpatrick The right time to act,is now,we are forever within the eternal now,it is literally now or never,yet few of us ever comprehend that reality encapsulated phrase!The consciousness of now is forever within us,it awaits our realization of its silent presence,when we do awaken,as we all must,we see that the answer to the riddle of life,of existence,all lie within the mind,tap into this eternal consciousness,and it will release the toe for you, from within itself? regards michael.

This is so true. There was a great Armenian mind Georges Ivanovich Gurdjieff.
He taught dance and wisdom and was known to teach that the ordinary human mind is in a state of almost sleep.

It was the rare mind that was more attuned to the realization of of consciousness. The concept of a link to all thought is not so strange. The really big challenge is whether we can rise to push ourselves beyond or through the boundary of paths set in motion for us.

If all thought is known, then free will is being able to make choice. Choice may not be as easy as we would like to believe. Imagine having the whole pressure of a predicted future based on the thoughts you make and shaping to accommodate them accordingly.

Consciousness is the key, all of us have a degree of consciousness. The key to knowing a choice is to firmly implant it and meditate upon it and feel the inner self guiding if it is good. Then firmly meditate upon the other. If it feels better or worse that is because it is.

Understanding consciousness is knowing you have choice, but it may actually take more effort than you really might think it does. Something to think on.

[mkirkpatrick]

Originally Posted by Sentient marine This is so true. There was a great Armenian mind Georges Ivanovich Gurdjieff. He taught dance and wisdom and was known to teach that the ordinary human mind is in a state of almost sleep. It was the rare mind that was more attuned to the realization of of consciousness. The concept of a link to all thought is not so strange. The really big challenge is whether we can rise to push ourselves beyond or through the boundary of paths set in motion for us. If all thought is known, then free will is being able to make choice. Choice may not be as easy as we would like to believe. Imagine having the whole pressure of a predicted future based on the thoughts you make and shaping to accommodate them accordingly. Consciousness is the key, all of us have a degree of consciousness. The key to knowing a choice is to firmly implant it and meditate upon it and feel the inner self guiding if it is good. Then firmly meditate upon the other. If it feels better or worse that is because it is. Understanding consciousness is knowing you have choice, but it may actually take more effort than you really might think it does. Something to think on.

You had made an important point there SM,that of understanding consciousness,we need
to understand the very thing of which flows through us all,and contains all the answers
to our endless questions ofwhy,when,how,etc,I thank you for pointing this out here.

warm regards michael.