Nothing by Nobody Nowhere (No Where = Now Here)

[mkirkpatrick]

If we imagine two stationary space ships - A and B - facing each other 1000 kilometers apart, no matter what B's performance capabilities it would never reach A's position before A, for the obvious reason that A's position is velocity-independent to A.

Now, if absolute speed were incorporated into this scenario, and B was "traveling" at such speed (would not really be traveling) it would reach A's position at the same point in time as A, which implies that distance is velocity-dependent.

Any velocity other than absolute results in an extension/dimension of time which translates into an extension/dimension of space, and if matter is nothing more than cumulative time-dependent space frames - fractal-type depth perception - we can deduce from this that without literal motion, the literalist view is hitherto moot (debatable).

What though Nobody if shots were fired!Although they are both stationary there "shots"
would not be,would then one shot hit the other ship?

regards michael.

[Fluent Piffle]

I wonder if Darwin formulated his Theory of Evolution around the text you cited, pif. I think alot of modern theories are based around very ancient concepts. Quantum Theory might be another one, since a few of its formulators frequented India and China.

Possibly, Nob!

My personal thoughts are that there can only be one necessary 'way' in which existence 'operates', due to the interconnection of all things, so whichever entity/part is predisposed to consider itself as this 'existence' will use its own metaphor of choice to do so. However, only when the metaphor/description is correctly aligned with its necessary Truth is the entity able to exist harmoniously within, and as part of, 'it(self)'...The very reason why anyone would want to 'go on a TOE quest', I think!

I also think that ALL attempts at description must arrive at the Infinite, by default. Whatever the claim, it ALWAYS has an Infinite conclusion, whether it be 'God, in his Infinite aspect', The Infinite 'void', or simply Infinite Space. I only prefer the latter because it is the only one I can visualise and find no contradiction with. As such, I do not 'dismiss' the others, but can just explain better without the 'additions'. All previous Honest descriptions, I can see, are relevant to their time of 'seeing'. (Something both Einstein and Rumi are also agreed upon).

You know, the greatest possible 'prize' of all, must be existence itself, I think. Here we are, sitting on the Mother of all Jackpots, and what are we doing with it? Are we spending our 'winnings' at all wisely?



pif.

[N0B0DY]

Michael,

The same velocity-dependent principle applies to the shots; if absolute speed is incorporated, there can then be no space between the ships. The scenario is further suggestive of the ships and shots not literally existing because if the absolute universe can only "travel" at absolute speed - translating to zero velocity/density - there can be no space between molecules, and further still atoms and subatomic particles (which is inclusive of string and wave concepts).

Pif,

I see your point about infinite space, but not in a literal sense as applicable to sensory perception because the process I propose is based on velocities that are impossible from what would be the holistic perspective of the absolute universe - re: the above consideration.

If you are referring to relativistic systems, then there can be an infinite number of them consisting of an infinite number of variable densities randomly interacting and observably ordered according to finite probability densities. If you recall Fredrick from this forum, he has put together a simplified explanation of how binary-type fluctuations can be applied to the theories of Relativity and Evolution, but my primary focus is with respect of the cause of spacetime and change, and how the changeless absolute frame fits into Relativity.

[N0B0DY]

You know, the greatest possible 'prize' of all, must be existence itself, I think. Here we are, sitting on the Mother of all Jackpots, and what are we doing with it? Are we spending our 'winnings' at all wisely?

I think this depends on our views of the Jackpots, which may be influenced by our particular circumstances. Some Jackpots may be stillborn and others quite deformed, and we may not be able to know just what the Mother is that creates these temporal Jackpots. Some folks like pain, some like boats, others like to veg on the beach, and still others don't know what they would want until they experienced it.

What can we say about a perfect existence, if imperfect individuals continue to perfect the world? What can be the basis for the wisdom required to spend our winnings?

[melanie]

Originally Posted by Fluent Piffle
You know, the greatest possible 'prize' of all, must be existence itself, I think. Here we are, sitting on the Mother of all Jackpots, and what are we doing with it? Are we spending our 'winnings' at all wisely?

Not sure i understand what is implied here.

I think this depends on our views of the Jackpots, which may be influenced by our particular circumstances. Some Jackpots may be stillborn and others quite deformed, and we may not be able to know just what the Mother is that creates these temporal Jackpots. Some folks like pain, some like boats, others like to veg on the beach, and still others don't know what they would want until they experienced it.

What can we say about a perfect existence, if imperfect individuals continue to perfect the world? What can be the basis for the wisdom required to spend our winnings?

As for perfections and imperfections they are both arising mutually together
AS appearances in THIS

Nothing wrong with it. IT is already perfect.

Nothing is imperfect unless 'we' label it so / separation /dual objective perception / conceptual.

The WHOLE of these arisings are already perfect and wonderful,
nothing needs to be fixed or perfected, it is arising .. As It Is
IN this already self evident self shining display of this IS-ness,
Perfect and Whole.
But if for example, an apparent entity, finds a cure for aids or cancer,

THAT cure is arising within THIS already conceived life story.
A mystery unknown,
and yet instantly known as sensations sensed [ONE WITH THE KNOWING]

truly an awesome miracle happening all by itself, To No-one


love melanie.

[N0B0DY]

Last Argument O.K. Honey! We're Here! You can come out now!

It's a good argument, Melanie, and keeping up to par with our Stanford-PhD status I propose it is moot whether or not Honey can Bee in, to come out...

"Quantum field theory (see the entry on quantum field theory) yields infinitely many representations of the commutation relations, which are inequivalent to the Schrödinger representation of standard quantum mechanics. Such inequivalent representations can be generated by spontaneous symmetry breaking (see the entry on symmetry and symmetry breaking), occuring when the ground state (or the vacuum state) of a system is not invariant under the full group of transformations providing the conservation laws for the system. If symmetry breaks down, collective modes are generated (so-called Nambu-Goldstone boson modes), which propagate over the system and introduce long-range correlations in it.

"These correlations are responsible for the emergence of ordered patterns. Unlike in thermal systems, a large number of bosons can be condensed in an ordered state in a highly stable fashion. Roughly speaking, this provides a quantum field theoretical derivation of ordered states in many-body systems described in terms of statistical physics. In the proposal by Umezawa these dynamically ordered states represent coherent activity in neuronal assemblies.

"The activation of a neuronal assembly is necessary to make the encoded content consciously accessible. This activation is considered to be initiated by external stimuli. Unless the assembly is activated, its content remains unconscious, unaccessed memory. According to Umezawa, coherent neuronal assemblies correlated to such memory states are regarded as vacuum states; their activation leads to excited states with a finite lifetime and enables a conscious recollection of the content encoded in the vacuum (ground) state."

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/qt-consciousness/#4.3

Thanks again for the interjection, Michael.

[N0B0DY]

"Nothing is imperfect unless 'we' label it so / separation /dual objective perception / conceptual."

This surely can't pertain to the separate instances of tanning on a beach and being attacked by a shark, though.

[melanie]

"Nothing is imperfect unless 'we' label it so / separation /dual objective perception / conceptual."

This surely can't pertain to the separate instances of tanning on a beach and being attacked by a shark, though.

The entity attacked by the shark, is an appearance arising in the eternal story

happening to no-one except as conceived.

'we' don't exist 'we' are only an appearance in AWARENESS
'we' are the dreamed.

It's like Virtual Reality......some find this hard to believe.

so Just as you do not throw a bucket of water on awakening from a night dream dreaming that your house is on fire.

No-one is really being attacked by a shark, except as an appearance in this

ETERNAL AWARENESS ....'we' are the fleeting apparent characters arising in the story. Not really existing except in our mind/consciousness.

mel.

To add on to this......

'Since resistance is inseparable from the mind, relinquishment of resistance - surrender - is the end of the mind as your master,
the impostor pretending to be "you," the false god. All judgement and all negativity dissolve.
The realm of Being, which had been obscured by the mind, then opens up.
Suddenly, a great stillness arises within you, an unfathomable sense of peace.
And within that peace, there is great joy.
And within that joy, there is love.
And at the innermost core, there is the sacred, the immeasurable, That which cannot be named.'

Eckhart Tolle. Practicing the Power of NOW.

***********************************************
And just one more thing to add here

Quote from michael, at .... Aurora's Cafe' Forum



Quote.
it is both 'you' and 'me'...

who are false gods...

of these two...

it is 'me'... who seems to be the most powerful... whose desires seem strongest...

yet neither has any power at all...

Hope this information helps Nobody.

[Fluent Piffle]

I think this depends on our views of the Jackpots, which may be influenced by our particular circumstances. Some Jackpots may be stillborn and others quite deformed, and we may not be able to know just what the Mother is that creates these temporal Jackpots. Some folks like pain, some like boats, others like to veg on the beach, and still others don't know what they would want until they experienced it.

What can we say about a perfect existence, if imperfect individuals continue to perfect the world? What can be the basis for the wisdom required to spend our winnings?

Yes, perhaps that last statement was a bit abstract. My apologies. I merely meant that to be 'existing' and then conscious of the fact, is possibly the greatest of all 'attainment'?

I do not necessarily disagree with melanie's conclusions here, in that existence itself is already as 'perfect' as it can be, regardless of its shapes and forms. They are what they are, and sometimes we just do not personally like certain aspects.



pif.

[N0B0DY]

I agree with Melanie's conclusion as well, pif, but only as it applies to the universe that requires no time to be perfected. For individuals who see no other way but to take the slow route through times of needless pain and torment, there is no escaping the "Eternal Return" of evolution until it is realized that everything is fully-evolved and -expanded.

Synonymous to absolute speed, which is zero speed, the required absolute knowledge is zero knowledge. The continual accumulation of knowledge via the procession can never suffice to rid existence of the chaos that creates disorder in the cosmos; the absolute can never be reached through a progressive means of experiencing what people classify as good and evil, and this runs contrary to the life all individuals subconsciously seek.

Consciousness can be correlated to what is experienced temporally as finite incremental times; subconsciousness with the governing factor of setting the parameters of incremental time and extending it infinitely/eternally; and absolute unconsciousness as the gateway to transcending the above parameters, and with it the differentiable pains and pleasures. The latter can be likened to those moments that you wish would never end, and they won't; and the former to those moments that you wish would end, and they never will.

How long did it take you to be born as you are this time? And how long would it take for you to be born according to the exact parameters required for you to be who you are, or slightly different, or very different? If you were born again into a life filled with pain and misery, even if it could in any way be justifiable, would you then want to be conscious of existence?