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White Belt

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06-20-2005, 06:59 PM
Two times

Hello everyone. Really interesting conversations in here.


This will be my first post here. Would appreciate comments, good, bad or just neutral as I believe that the only time we are making real progress is when we exchange different views and ideas. I am not very good in mathematics so when Im stuck in that I will ask someone here to help! I am not good at pure details, like maths, but it compensates because I have a strong abstract thinking and a good ability to imagine things. I will write down my highly speculative and incomplete Theory of everything.

The key in my theory is our own built-in flaw. We are equipped with an amazing organic supercomputer with a self-reflecting property. We can not only reflect our selves with it but also the rest of the world and the people that we meet. We can also reflect over such abstract things as time. That is there I think our flaw exists… in our perception of time.

In this forum many interesting views on time has been written down. I have had the view on time for many years that it is mainly an abstract word for change… a practical definition of change. Einstein described time in a fine and correct combination of the abstract word “time” and its connection with space/change… yea, space-time. But even with a correct definition something remained largely unsolved as far as I know. The DIRECTION of time! In common sense we see time as going “forwards” because we all do things and the world always changes and therefore the world and time would go “forwards”. And we never actually see that time would go the other way… the cat never fixes the ming-vase in a perfect reversed order after it crashed it to the floor. Even though it is suggested that time could go backwards we haven’t any evidence of that. But wait a second… if the direction of time isn’t discovered as a fact… how then would we know what direction we are going? Okey, if time only goes in one way it doesent matter… the definition would of course be “forwards” anyway cause we can only relate to ourselves and this world. However, what if time did have the property of going both forwards and backwards simultaneously? I know this sounds crazy but think about it. Would we perceive that it actually had the property of going both ways or would we still think that it only goes one way due to a simple fact that our brain “normalises” everything so it looked fine? Of course I came to consider the law of cause and action. In a universe with time going in (at least) two directions this law should be seen broken on some occasions… sometimes event B would be the cause for event A which to an observer with A-B direction would seem very strange.

My intention here is to really deep-scan our view of things at this fundamental level. Could there be something with time we completely missed because we are so used to see the world as we see it and we cannot view time very easily in another way? I am not sure myself that this thought is leading somewhere… but somehow I see this possibility that we have missed something crucial about time. Is it that time is not what we expect it to be… or is it that time ABSOLUTELY NOT is what we expect it to be?

So where are the possible tracks of where time is reversed? This is very speculative but I give it a go anyway. Lately I have read through numerous texts about evolution… the old debate between Darwinists and creationists is raging! Now… I am an agnostic and an explorer (thereby my name) of the truth and therefore I take no real side in this debate. As far as I know both sides may be right. It is very interesting to read their arguments… this type of raging debate produces 1) extreme propaganda for the “home-team” 2) a lot of facts (or disinformation which goes in propaganda nr 1 ). I think that there is no way of finding out something faster or better than when there has been this enormous debate about a subject. I can only say that if any tracks of reversed time is present before our noses it would be in the evolution. There is just some things that I find impossible to explain! That is until my own thought on reversed time came to existence… then some things which are a total mystery would be crystal clear evidence of a time going the other way. Actually someone, think it was Fred Hoyle, stated that time travel in radiation would cause some of the effects in evolution (however the connection between micro and micro-universe is really far from true as we haven’t seen evidence on that those would affect each other that way OR a real time travel)… and that is somehow related to my thought but I actually state that the world itself is an order of two (or more) specific movements (my preferred word for “time”) existing and causing effects simultaneously. I want to avoid a big debate about evolution (maybe another thread would be good for that) and just say a few example in evolution I find strange enough to fit my hypothetical world-view:

1. The fact that scientists not yet have created any life-molecules (proteins, DNA and so on) in the thought natural environment where life is said to have evolved.

2. An animal taking the form of the environment in an advanced way (example those green leaf-insects).

3. Advanced behaviour or building skills (bees).

4. Human beings and our incredible brain.

Of course I am aware that evolution may have some extraordinary way to make the rich world we see complete. If someone would fill in this list or have a good view of evolution and its explanations feel free to speak though!

These last things from now on is my latest thought on a universe with 2 time-directions. I only know of one case there it is said that an event is completely irreversible (please feel free to say if you know any more)… the case of a particle named K (with a little zero down to the right and some other number up at the right). So we apparently have a world that at least in theory mainly can go in two directions in time without breaking any major laws. The problem of movement that are reversed… if time for a group of object would reverse, would things go “as they are supposed to do” or does the nature of such dramatic changes instead offer some combination of reversed-vs-normal? Is this combination the universe that I have described? I accept the big bang theory but I suggest a possible “opening-sequence” there some early parts of the universe actually travelled much faster than light-speed (might be possible if all forces were one in the beginning as described) therefore creating a reversed order/time. How much normal and reversed movement that were created … lets say for example 50-50.

Well, when I finally got this far I am going to state that our consciousness is a product reflecting the universe of two times working with each other. One part of the world knows “forwards” and understands itself by co-operating and observing the “backwards” part of the world and the other way around. In itself the world is self-aware… to what degree is another question but our brain is somehow the perfect reflection (reflection within reflection) of this self-aware universe.


This theory is as I said speculative but it deals with the concepts of movement/time and our own perception of what is what… as I said in the beginning I have a feeling that our view on time is far from complete and that it is among the hardest things to actually imagine in our minds. My theory also has some advantage in capable of explaining several issues that MIGHT come true in future experiments. The disadvantage of it is my own cause… I am really bad in maths so if anyone would think it is worthy of calculating some of the possible math behind my theory I would be very happy!
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06-23-2005, 10:30 AM
hi explorer,

I think your theory makes sense. Now, do both dimensions of time curve with gravity?
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06-23-2005, 10:53 AM
Hello Guille!

After my first post here in I stumbled upon an intersting side-debate between you and subversion in "Are Super-Luminal speeds possible?" which covered some of the things in my TOE. I noticed then that I actually didnt consider gravitys part in my theory when I thought it out. I believe I avoided gravity due to partly that we havent yet observed the graviton (anti-graviton too which could make things more easy to overview) which is thought to deliver gravitation.

But if I would make a guess the answer is yes... at least in my own thought we would end up with some strange happenings if two times were combined in this world and one of them didnt get affected by gravity.
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06-23-2005, 10:59 AM
Thanks for giving the answer anyway.

Bu the way, gravitons hypothetically haveno charge so they are them-selves anti-particle. I foyu are think on anti-force of gravit, then I disagree, it just complicates things.

But if you don't accept gravity, what makes the earth go around the sun?
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06-23-2005, 11:13 AM
Oh, I actually didnt know that about the hypothetical graviton, thanx for telling. And I meant an anti-particle which didnt play a major part in the universe rather that it would tell us more about how the graviton itself works. Gravity makes the earth go around the sun, I believe that for sure
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07-04-2005, 06:39 PM
Hi Explorer;

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..Even though it is suggested that time could go backwards..
I would like to know who or which equation suggests that time can go backwards?
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07-04-2005, 07:01 PM
Hi XarGoth

In short of time nowdays I would appriciate if someone in here would answere that question... else I shall try to find a source for that statement.
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